Company 'expecting' me to take a month unpaid leave after resignation
I recently resigned with my current company, following both the corresponding laws and the company handbook. Legally they still have to keep/pay me for a month, as that is what my contract (Permanent/'onbepaalde tijd') and the law here (Netherlands) say. Even if they would fire me (which would be very difficult here), law states they need to keep me on for a whole month.
However I work interim based and me leaving means they can't put me on a project for the last month. Because of this they told me 'We expect you to take unpaid leave as this is highly inconvenient for us and you can't be profitable to us if you sit at home for a month.'
Now, legally, this is not my problem. In the real world however, it is. Because I now have to have a meeting with my boss who now thinks I'm an annoying twat who will just cost him money over the next month and will then have to probably spend a month staring at my screen at their office.
Any tips/ideas on how to either resolve this or smooth out this meeting? I asked my new job if I can start there earlier but due to the holidays this wasn't possible. I have absolutely no interest in going without pay for a month either.
resignation netherlands
add a comment |
I recently resigned with my current company, following both the corresponding laws and the company handbook. Legally they still have to keep/pay me for a month, as that is what my contract (Permanent/'onbepaalde tijd') and the law here (Netherlands) say. Even if they would fire me (which would be very difficult here), law states they need to keep me on for a whole month.
However I work interim based and me leaving means they can't put me on a project for the last month. Because of this they told me 'We expect you to take unpaid leave as this is highly inconvenient for us and you can't be profitable to us if you sit at home for a month.'
Now, legally, this is not my problem. In the real world however, it is. Because I now have to have a meeting with my boss who now thinks I'm an annoying twat who will just cost him money over the next month and will then have to probably spend a month staring at my screen at their office.
Any tips/ideas on how to either resolve this or smooth out this meeting? I asked my new job if I can start there earlier but due to the holidays this wasn't possible. I have absolutely no interest in going without pay for a month either.
resignation netherlands
3
Wouldn't that happen for anyone else who leaves too? It sounds like they're just trying to shaft you and see if it works.
– thursdaysgeek
46 mins ago
1
@thursdaysgeek yeah it probably will, leaving perfectly in between projects seems like a stretch in most cases, especially because most projects are ended/prolonged on very short notice. I thought the same as you, they acted like this has never happened to them yet they have about 80 interim employees now so I highly doubt that.
– Summer
44 mins ago
It sounds like they are trying to completely ignore the laws of your jurisdiction, and, completely shaft you. Very unfortunately, your only response is to get a solicitor. Unfortunately this is your one, and only, option.
– Fattie
6 mins ago
add a comment |
I recently resigned with my current company, following both the corresponding laws and the company handbook. Legally they still have to keep/pay me for a month, as that is what my contract (Permanent/'onbepaalde tijd') and the law here (Netherlands) say. Even if they would fire me (which would be very difficult here), law states they need to keep me on for a whole month.
However I work interim based and me leaving means they can't put me on a project for the last month. Because of this they told me 'We expect you to take unpaid leave as this is highly inconvenient for us and you can't be profitable to us if you sit at home for a month.'
Now, legally, this is not my problem. In the real world however, it is. Because I now have to have a meeting with my boss who now thinks I'm an annoying twat who will just cost him money over the next month and will then have to probably spend a month staring at my screen at their office.
Any tips/ideas on how to either resolve this or smooth out this meeting? I asked my new job if I can start there earlier but due to the holidays this wasn't possible. I have absolutely no interest in going without pay for a month either.
resignation netherlands
I recently resigned with my current company, following both the corresponding laws and the company handbook. Legally they still have to keep/pay me for a month, as that is what my contract (Permanent/'onbepaalde tijd') and the law here (Netherlands) say. Even if they would fire me (which would be very difficult here), law states they need to keep me on for a whole month.
However I work interim based and me leaving means they can't put me on a project for the last month. Because of this they told me 'We expect you to take unpaid leave as this is highly inconvenient for us and you can't be profitable to us if you sit at home for a month.'
Now, legally, this is not my problem. In the real world however, it is. Because I now have to have a meeting with my boss who now thinks I'm an annoying twat who will just cost him money over the next month and will then have to probably spend a month staring at my screen at their office.
Any tips/ideas on how to either resolve this or smooth out this meeting? I asked my new job if I can start there earlier but due to the holidays this wasn't possible. I have absolutely no interest in going without pay for a month either.
resignation netherlands
resignation netherlands
edited 1 hour ago
Dan Pichelman
26.9k137488
26.9k137488
asked 1 hour ago
Summer
3,86061935
3,86061935
3
Wouldn't that happen for anyone else who leaves too? It sounds like they're just trying to shaft you and see if it works.
– thursdaysgeek
46 mins ago
1
@thursdaysgeek yeah it probably will, leaving perfectly in between projects seems like a stretch in most cases, especially because most projects are ended/prolonged on very short notice. I thought the same as you, they acted like this has never happened to them yet they have about 80 interim employees now so I highly doubt that.
– Summer
44 mins ago
It sounds like they are trying to completely ignore the laws of your jurisdiction, and, completely shaft you. Very unfortunately, your only response is to get a solicitor. Unfortunately this is your one, and only, option.
– Fattie
6 mins ago
add a comment |
3
Wouldn't that happen for anyone else who leaves too? It sounds like they're just trying to shaft you and see if it works.
– thursdaysgeek
46 mins ago
1
@thursdaysgeek yeah it probably will, leaving perfectly in between projects seems like a stretch in most cases, especially because most projects are ended/prolonged on very short notice. I thought the same as you, they acted like this has never happened to them yet they have about 80 interim employees now so I highly doubt that.
– Summer
44 mins ago
It sounds like they are trying to completely ignore the laws of your jurisdiction, and, completely shaft you. Very unfortunately, your only response is to get a solicitor. Unfortunately this is your one, and only, option.
– Fattie
6 mins ago
3
3
Wouldn't that happen for anyone else who leaves too? It sounds like they're just trying to shaft you and see if it works.
– thursdaysgeek
46 mins ago
Wouldn't that happen for anyone else who leaves too? It sounds like they're just trying to shaft you and see if it works.
– thursdaysgeek
46 mins ago
1
1
@thursdaysgeek yeah it probably will, leaving perfectly in between projects seems like a stretch in most cases, especially because most projects are ended/prolonged on very short notice. I thought the same as you, they acted like this has never happened to them yet they have about 80 interim employees now so I highly doubt that.
– Summer
44 mins ago
@thursdaysgeek yeah it probably will, leaving perfectly in between projects seems like a stretch in most cases, especially because most projects are ended/prolonged on very short notice. I thought the same as you, they acted like this has never happened to them yet they have about 80 interim employees now so I highly doubt that.
– Summer
44 mins ago
It sounds like they are trying to completely ignore the laws of your jurisdiction, and, completely shaft you. Very unfortunately, your only response is to get a solicitor. Unfortunately this is your one, and only, option.
– Fattie
6 mins ago
It sounds like they are trying to completely ignore the laws of your jurisdiction, and, completely shaft you. Very unfortunately, your only response is to get a solicitor. Unfortunately this is your one, and only, option.
– Fattie
6 mins ago
add a comment |
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
I'd go in with something valuable you can do over that month so it's not you playing minesweeper at your desk. If you've been there long enough you should know some things that need to get done but never do, which should take a few weeks to complete. Basically you want to go with the attitude of:
Hey look, legally you need to keep me around, so here's this thing I
can do of value during that time. I'll provide good documentation along the way so that you guys can maintain / understand what I did.
Speaking for myself as a manager, I rarely get everything I want. But if I can make the situation palatable, I'm good with that. Less legal exposure for the firm, you're having the right attitude and not talking smack on us internally for the next month, and something good is getting done. I'd be okay with that, and hopefully your boss will be as well.
add a comment |
If they are starting from such an extreme position then its going to be difficult to get this to a "smooth" resolution.
It's not unreasonable for you to try and mitigate the issue by starting at the new role earlier but you''ve explored that and it's non starter. Presumably you are already going to use any remaining annual leave but I'm guessing that's not significant or you'd have mentioned it.
I think you need to make it absolutely clear that going without pay is not on the table..paying you for your entitled period isn't optional and the fact that it's not profitable for them is to put it bluntly not your problem, its a cost of doing business and if they aren't prepared to do that they shouldn't be in business.
That said you can try and smooth things a bit by suggesting ways you can providing as much value as you can during that time, there will almost certainly be something you can do that has value and its up to then whether they take advantage of that or decide to be difficult.
So be as reasonable and willing as you can on how you send that month but stay firm on getting paid. The rest is up to them.
add a comment |
Frankly, what they say is their problem and not yours. And it's their problem in the real world. Your boss is just being stupid.
If a company in the EU gives you notice up to day X then they have to pay you up to day X, and that's that. No discussions at all. You can tell them that what they want you to do is absolute nonsense, that you are not taking unpaid holidays, and that if they think about not paying you then you will have to get a lawyer, and they will pay both your salary and your lawyer.
If they don't want you to sit in the office for a month staring at your screen, they have three choices: Payment in lieu of notice (that is, you are laid off immediately, but they pay you your salary for you giving up your notice), gardening leave (they tell you to stay at home, still paying your salary), or they find something useful for you to do.
I must say that their demand is so ridiculous and outrageous, I wouldn't have the slightest inclination to make this any easier for them. And you don't need to care about what your boss thinks of you - I think it is quite clear what I think and what you should think of him.
Wish I could up vote this more. The boss has showed their hand, and it's not going to be easy. The answer from Eric may be the most diplomatic, but it is the job of the managers to manage their resources properly. If they can't do that, that's their problem. It's not the resources job to find things to do.
– UKMonkey
19 mins ago
add a comment |
The point of having a notice period is that it gives your employer time to settle its affairs with you. That is, they have some time to find people (usually coworkers) who can take over project. In an ideal situation, you'd spend most of your time writing documentation, giving trainings, etc.
If they don't have anything for you to do, that is not your problem. You are available, and you are getting paid for that. If they don't want to benefit from that, it's their loss, not yours.
If they threaten to withhold your salary, contact your union (if you are a member) -- most, if not all, give free legal support when it comes to labour conflicts. Otherwise, if you are insured for that ("rechtbijstandsverzekering"), contact your insurance company. Else, find a lawyer.
add a comment |
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4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
I'd go in with something valuable you can do over that month so it's not you playing minesweeper at your desk. If you've been there long enough you should know some things that need to get done but never do, which should take a few weeks to complete. Basically you want to go with the attitude of:
Hey look, legally you need to keep me around, so here's this thing I
can do of value during that time. I'll provide good documentation along the way so that you guys can maintain / understand what I did.
Speaking for myself as a manager, I rarely get everything I want. But if I can make the situation palatable, I'm good with that. Less legal exposure for the firm, you're having the right attitude and not talking smack on us internally for the next month, and something good is getting done. I'd be okay with that, and hopefully your boss will be as well.
add a comment |
I'd go in with something valuable you can do over that month so it's not you playing minesweeper at your desk. If you've been there long enough you should know some things that need to get done but never do, which should take a few weeks to complete. Basically you want to go with the attitude of:
Hey look, legally you need to keep me around, so here's this thing I
can do of value during that time. I'll provide good documentation along the way so that you guys can maintain / understand what I did.
Speaking for myself as a manager, I rarely get everything I want. But if I can make the situation palatable, I'm good with that. Less legal exposure for the firm, you're having the right attitude and not talking smack on us internally for the next month, and something good is getting done. I'd be okay with that, and hopefully your boss will be as well.
add a comment |
I'd go in with something valuable you can do over that month so it's not you playing minesweeper at your desk. If you've been there long enough you should know some things that need to get done but never do, which should take a few weeks to complete. Basically you want to go with the attitude of:
Hey look, legally you need to keep me around, so here's this thing I
can do of value during that time. I'll provide good documentation along the way so that you guys can maintain / understand what I did.
Speaking for myself as a manager, I rarely get everything I want. But if I can make the situation palatable, I'm good with that. Less legal exposure for the firm, you're having the right attitude and not talking smack on us internally for the next month, and something good is getting done. I'd be okay with that, and hopefully your boss will be as well.
I'd go in with something valuable you can do over that month so it's not you playing minesweeper at your desk. If you've been there long enough you should know some things that need to get done but never do, which should take a few weeks to complete. Basically you want to go with the attitude of:
Hey look, legally you need to keep me around, so here's this thing I
can do of value during that time. I'll provide good documentation along the way so that you guys can maintain / understand what I did.
Speaking for myself as a manager, I rarely get everything I want. But if I can make the situation palatable, I'm good with that. Less legal exposure for the firm, you're having the right attitude and not talking smack on us internally for the next month, and something good is getting done. I'd be okay with that, and hopefully your boss will be as well.
answered 1 hour ago
Eric
1,14221016
1,14221016
add a comment |
add a comment |
If they are starting from such an extreme position then its going to be difficult to get this to a "smooth" resolution.
It's not unreasonable for you to try and mitigate the issue by starting at the new role earlier but you''ve explored that and it's non starter. Presumably you are already going to use any remaining annual leave but I'm guessing that's not significant or you'd have mentioned it.
I think you need to make it absolutely clear that going without pay is not on the table..paying you for your entitled period isn't optional and the fact that it's not profitable for them is to put it bluntly not your problem, its a cost of doing business and if they aren't prepared to do that they shouldn't be in business.
That said you can try and smooth things a bit by suggesting ways you can providing as much value as you can during that time, there will almost certainly be something you can do that has value and its up to then whether they take advantage of that or decide to be difficult.
So be as reasonable and willing as you can on how you send that month but stay firm on getting paid. The rest is up to them.
add a comment |
If they are starting from such an extreme position then its going to be difficult to get this to a "smooth" resolution.
It's not unreasonable for you to try and mitigate the issue by starting at the new role earlier but you''ve explored that and it's non starter. Presumably you are already going to use any remaining annual leave but I'm guessing that's not significant or you'd have mentioned it.
I think you need to make it absolutely clear that going without pay is not on the table..paying you for your entitled period isn't optional and the fact that it's not profitable for them is to put it bluntly not your problem, its a cost of doing business and if they aren't prepared to do that they shouldn't be in business.
That said you can try and smooth things a bit by suggesting ways you can providing as much value as you can during that time, there will almost certainly be something you can do that has value and its up to then whether they take advantage of that or decide to be difficult.
So be as reasonable and willing as you can on how you send that month but stay firm on getting paid. The rest is up to them.
add a comment |
If they are starting from such an extreme position then its going to be difficult to get this to a "smooth" resolution.
It's not unreasonable for you to try and mitigate the issue by starting at the new role earlier but you''ve explored that and it's non starter. Presumably you are already going to use any remaining annual leave but I'm guessing that's not significant or you'd have mentioned it.
I think you need to make it absolutely clear that going without pay is not on the table..paying you for your entitled period isn't optional and the fact that it's not profitable for them is to put it bluntly not your problem, its a cost of doing business and if they aren't prepared to do that they shouldn't be in business.
That said you can try and smooth things a bit by suggesting ways you can providing as much value as you can during that time, there will almost certainly be something you can do that has value and its up to then whether they take advantage of that or decide to be difficult.
So be as reasonable and willing as you can on how you send that month but stay firm on getting paid. The rest is up to them.
If they are starting from such an extreme position then its going to be difficult to get this to a "smooth" resolution.
It's not unreasonable for you to try and mitigate the issue by starting at the new role earlier but you''ve explored that and it's non starter. Presumably you are already going to use any remaining annual leave but I'm guessing that's not significant or you'd have mentioned it.
I think you need to make it absolutely clear that going without pay is not on the table..paying you for your entitled period isn't optional and the fact that it's not profitable for them is to put it bluntly not your problem, its a cost of doing business and if they aren't prepared to do that they shouldn't be in business.
That said you can try and smooth things a bit by suggesting ways you can providing as much value as you can during that time, there will almost certainly be something you can do that has value and its up to then whether they take advantage of that or decide to be difficult.
So be as reasonable and willing as you can on how you send that month but stay firm on getting paid. The rest is up to them.
answered 57 mins ago
motosubatsu
42.5k22106171
42.5k22106171
add a comment |
add a comment |
Frankly, what they say is their problem and not yours. And it's their problem in the real world. Your boss is just being stupid.
If a company in the EU gives you notice up to day X then they have to pay you up to day X, and that's that. No discussions at all. You can tell them that what they want you to do is absolute nonsense, that you are not taking unpaid holidays, and that if they think about not paying you then you will have to get a lawyer, and they will pay both your salary and your lawyer.
If they don't want you to sit in the office for a month staring at your screen, they have three choices: Payment in lieu of notice (that is, you are laid off immediately, but they pay you your salary for you giving up your notice), gardening leave (they tell you to stay at home, still paying your salary), or they find something useful for you to do.
I must say that their demand is so ridiculous and outrageous, I wouldn't have the slightest inclination to make this any easier for them. And you don't need to care about what your boss thinks of you - I think it is quite clear what I think and what you should think of him.
Wish I could up vote this more. The boss has showed their hand, and it's not going to be easy. The answer from Eric may be the most diplomatic, but it is the job of the managers to manage their resources properly. If they can't do that, that's their problem. It's not the resources job to find things to do.
– UKMonkey
19 mins ago
add a comment |
Frankly, what they say is their problem and not yours. And it's their problem in the real world. Your boss is just being stupid.
If a company in the EU gives you notice up to day X then they have to pay you up to day X, and that's that. No discussions at all. You can tell them that what they want you to do is absolute nonsense, that you are not taking unpaid holidays, and that if they think about not paying you then you will have to get a lawyer, and they will pay both your salary and your lawyer.
If they don't want you to sit in the office for a month staring at your screen, they have three choices: Payment in lieu of notice (that is, you are laid off immediately, but they pay you your salary for you giving up your notice), gardening leave (they tell you to stay at home, still paying your salary), or they find something useful for you to do.
I must say that their demand is so ridiculous and outrageous, I wouldn't have the slightest inclination to make this any easier for them. And you don't need to care about what your boss thinks of you - I think it is quite clear what I think and what you should think of him.
Wish I could up vote this more. The boss has showed their hand, and it's not going to be easy. The answer from Eric may be the most diplomatic, but it is the job of the managers to manage their resources properly. If they can't do that, that's their problem. It's not the resources job to find things to do.
– UKMonkey
19 mins ago
add a comment |
Frankly, what they say is their problem and not yours. And it's their problem in the real world. Your boss is just being stupid.
If a company in the EU gives you notice up to day X then they have to pay you up to day X, and that's that. No discussions at all. You can tell them that what they want you to do is absolute nonsense, that you are not taking unpaid holidays, and that if they think about not paying you then you will have to get a lawyer, and they will pay both your salary and your lawyer.
If they don't want you to sit in the office for a month staring at your screen, they have three choices: Payment in lieu of notice (that is, you are laid off immediately, but they pay you your salary for you giving up your notice), gardening leave (they tell you to stay at home, still paying your salary), or they find something useful for you to do.
I must say that their demand is so ridiculous and outrageous, I wouldn't have the slightest inclination to make this any easier for them. And you don't need to care about what your boss thinks of you - I think it is quite clear what I think and what you should think of him.
Frankly, what they say is their problem and not yours. And it's their problem in the real world. Your boss is just being stupid.
If a company in the EU gives you notice up to day X then they have to pay you up to day X, and that's that. No discussions at all. You can tell them that what they want you to do is absolute nonsense, that you are not taking unpaid holidays, and that if they think about not paying you then you will have to get a lawyer, and they will pay both your salary and your lawyer.
If they don't want you to sit in the office for a month staring at your screen, they have three choices: Payment in lieu of notice (that is, you are laid off immediately, but they pay you your salary for you giving up your notice), gardening leave (they tell you to stay at home, still paying your salary), or they find something useful for you to do.
I must say that their demand is so ridiculous and outrageous, I wouldn't have the slightest inclination to make this any easier for them. And you don't need to care about what your boss thinks of you - I think it is quite clear what I think and what you should think of him.
edited 47 mins ago
answered 52 mins ago
gnasher729
82.4k36147262
82.4k36147262
Wish I could up vote this more. The boss has showed their hand, and it's not going to be easy. The answer from Eric may be the most diplomatic, but it is the job of the managers to manage their resources properly. If they can't do that, that's their problem. It's not the resources job to find things to do.
– UKMonkey
19 mins ago
add a comment |
Wish I could up vote this more. The boss has showed their hand, and it's not going to be easy. The answer from Eric may be the most diplomatic, but it is the job of the managers to manage their resources properly. If they can't do that, that's their problem. It's not the resources job to find things to do.
– UKMonkey
19 mins ago
Wish I could up vote this more. The boss has showed their hand, and it's not going to be easy. The answer from Eric may be the most diplomatic, but it is the job of the managers to manage their resources properly. If they can't do that, that's their problem. It's not the resources job to find things to do.
– UKMonkey
19 mins ago
Wish I could up vote this more. The boss has showed their hand, and it's not going to be easy. The answer from Eric may be the most diplomatic, but it is the job of the managers to manage their resources properly. If they can't do that, that's their problem. It's not the resources job to find things to do.
– UKMonkey
19 mins ago
add a comment |
The point of having a notice period is that it gives your employer time to settle its affairs with you. That is, they have some time to find people (usually coworkers) who can take over project. In an ideal situation, you'd spend most of your time writing documentation, giving trainings, etc.
If they don't have anything for you to do, that is not your problem. You are available, and you are getting paid for that. If they don't want to benefit from that, it's their loss, not yours.
If they threaten to withhold your salary, contact your union (if you are a member) -- most, if not all, give free legal support when it comes to labour conflicts. Otherwise, if you are insured for that ("rechtbijstandsverzekering"), contact your insurance company. Else, find a lawyer.
add a comment |
The point of having a notice period is that it gives your employer time to settle its affairs with you. That is, they have some time to find people (usually coworkers) who can take over project. In an ideal situation, you'd spend most of your time writing documentation, giving trainings, etc.
If they don't have anything for you to do, that is not your problem. You are available, and you are getting paid for that. If they don't want to benefit from that, it's their loss, not yours.
If they threaten to withhold your salary, contact your union (if you are a member) -- most, if not all, give free legal support when it comes to labour conflicts. Otherwise, if you are insured for that ("rechtbijstandsverzekering"), contact your insurance company. Else, find a lawyer.
add a comment |
The point of having a notice period is that it gives your employer time to settle its affairs with you. That is, they have some time to find people (usually coworkers) who can take over project. In an ideal situation, you'd spend most of your time writing documentation, giving trainings, etc.
If they don't have anything for you to do, that is not your problem. You are available, and you are getting paid for that. If they don't want to benefit from that, it's their loss, not yours.
If they threaten to withhold your salary, contact your union (if you are a member) -- most, if not all, give free legal support when it comes to labour conflicts. Otherwise, if you are insured for that ("rechtbijstandsverzekering"), contact your insurance company. Else, find a lawyer.
The point of having a notice period is that it gives your employer time to settle its affairs with you. That is, they have some time to find people (usually coworkers) who can take over project. In an ideal situation, you'd spend most of your time writing documentation, giving trainings, etc.
If they don't have anything for you to do, that is not your problem. You are available, and you are getting paid for that. If they don't want to benefit from that, it's their loss, not yours.
If they threaten to withhold your salary, contact your union (if you are a member) -- most, if not all, give free legal support when it comes to labour conflicts. Otherwise, if you are insured for that ("rechtbijstandsverzekering"), contact your insurance company. Else, find a lawyer.
answered 13 mins ago
Abigail
1,2251410
1,2251410
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3
Wouldn't that happen for anyone else who leaves too? It sounds like they're just trying to shaft you and see if it works.
– thursdaysgeek
46 mins ago
1
@thursdaysgeek yeah it probably will, leaving perfectly in between projects seems like a stretch in most cases, especially because most projects are ended/prolonged on very short notice. I thought the same as you, they acted like this has never happened to them yet they have about 80 interim employees now so I highly doubt that.
– Summer
44 mins ago
It sounds like they are trying to completely ignore the laws of your jurisdiction, and, completely shaft you. Very unfortunately, your only response is to get a solicitor. Unfortunately this is your one, and only, option.
– Fattie
6 mins ago