How to certify a secret decision revealed on a delay in a play-by-post game?











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In a play-by-post game that requires a player to commit to a secret decision and later reveal that decision publicly, how can a player certify that they did so honestly without just relying on good faith? Consider the following example.




  1. Alice commits to a decision, like pre-programming an action she will take. An onlooker might notice she's doing something but they wouldn't know the particulars.

  2. Though Bob doesn't know exactly what Alice is up to, he commits to a decision in response to that, like reacting to stop her. Resolving his decision will depend on resolving her decision.

  3. Alice has to reveal what her committed decision was after the fact in order to resolve it at this point along with Bob's reaction to it. If she's being honest or has a way to certify what her decision was, this is fine. If she is able to lie, she could change her decision retroactively.


Are there common tools, techniques, or conventions to support this? At a table, Alice could simply write her decision in a folded note card and reveal it later; or in a board game, she could play her action card face down and reveal it later. These common table conventions don't translate well to online play. So, how can Alice certify her secret decision to be revealed on a delay?



Assume the game has a GM but that the GM is also a player (possibly evil an adversarial one) in need of certifying their decisions and can't act as a proxy for the other players.



Also assume the system is not freeform: there are rules imposing some restrictions on the possible decisions a player might need to certify.










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  • 2




    As a useful practical example where the described scenario would crop up, combat in Mouse Guard (and presumably other Burning Wheel system games) is resolved with the GM and players each secretly deciding on three actions before revealing them all at once and resolving the round of combat
    – Pingcode
    21 hours ago















up vote
29
down vote

favorite
4












In a play-by-post game that requires a player to commit to a secret decision and later reveal that decision publicly, how can a player certify that they did so honestly without just relying on good faith? Consider the following example.




  1. Alice commits to a decision, like pre-programming an action she will take. An onlooker might notice she's doing something but they wouldn't know the particulars.

  2. Though Bob doesn't know exactly what Alice is up to, he commits to a decision in response to that, like reacting to stop her. Resolving his decision will depend on resolving her decision.

  3. Alice has to reveal what her committed decision was after the fact in order to resolve it at this point along with Bob's reaction to it. If she's being honest or has a way to certify what her decision was, this is fine. If she is able to lie, she could change her decision retroactively.


Are there common tools, techniques, or conventions to support this? At a table, Alice could simply write her decision in a folded note card and reveal it later; or in a board game, she could play her action card face down and reveal it later. These common table conventions don't translate well to online play. So, how can Alice certify her secret decision to be revealed on a delay?



Assume the game has a GM but that the GM is also a player (possibly evil an adversarial one) in need of certifying their decisions and can't act as a proxy for the other players.



Also assume the system is not freeform: there are rules imposing some restrictions on the possible decisions a player might need to certify.










share|improve this question




















  • 2




    As a useful practical example where the described scenario would crop up, combat in Mouse Guard (and presumably other Burning Wheel system games) is resolved with the GM and players each secretly deciding on three actions before revealing them all at once and resolving the round of combat
    – Pingcode
    21 hours ago













up vote
29
down vote

favorite
4









up vote
29
down vote

favorite
4






4





In a play-by-post game that requires a player to commit to a secret decision and later reveal that decision publicly, how can a player certify that they did so honestly without just relying on good faith? Consider the following example.




  1. Alice commits to a decision, like pre-programming an action she will take. An onlooker might notice she's doing something but they wouldn't know the particulars.

  2. Though Bob doesn't know exactly what Alice is up to, he commits to a decision in response to that, like reacting to stop her. Resolving his decision will depend on resolving her decision.

  3. Alice has to reveal what her committed decision was after the fact in order to resolve it at this point along with Bob's reaction to it. If she's being honest or has a way to certify what her decision was, this is fine. If she is able to lie, she could change her decision retroactively.


Are there common tools, techniques, or conventions to support this? At a table, Alice could simply write her decision in a folded note card and reveal it later; or in a board game, she could play her action card face down and reveal it later. These common table conventions don't translate well to online play. So, how can Alice certify her secret decision to be revealed on a delay?



Assume the game has a GM but that the GM is also a player (possibly evil an adversarial one) in need of certifying their decisions and can't act as a proxy for the other players.



Also assume the system is not freeform: there are rules imposing some restrictions on the possible decisions a player might need to certify.










share|improve this question















In a play-by-post game that requires a player to commit to a secret decision and later reveal that decision publicly, how can a player certify that they did so honestly without just relying on good faith? Consider the following example.




  1. Alice commits to a decision, like pre-programming an action she will take. An onlooker might notice she's doing something but they wouldn't know the particulars.

  2. Though Bob doesn't know exactly what Alice is up to, he commits to a decision in response to that, like reacting to stop her. Resolving his decision will depend on resolving her decision.

  3. Alice has to reveal what her committed decision was after the fact in order to resolve it at this point along with Bob's reaction to it. If she's being honest or has a way to certify what her decision was, this is fine. If she is able to lie, she could change her decision retroactively.


Are there common tools, techniques, or conventions to support this? At a table, Alice could simply write her decision in a folded note card and reveal it later; or in a board game, she could play her action card face down and reveal it later. These common table conventions don't translate well to online play. So, how can Alice certify her secret decision to be revealed on a delay?



Assume the game has a GM but that the GM is also a player (possibly evil an adversarial one) in need of certifying their decisions and can't act as a proxy for the other players.



Also assume the system is not freeform: there are rules imposing some restrictions on the possible decisions a player might need to certify.







play-by-post






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edited 2 hours ago

























asked yesterday









Bloodcinder

17.9k260118




17.9k260118








  • 2




    As a useful practical example where the described scenario would crop up, combat in Mouse Guard (and presumably other Burning Wheel system games) is resolved with the GM and players each secretly deciding on three actions before revealing them all at once and resolving the round of combat
    – Pingcode
    21 hours ago














  • 2




    As a useful practical example where the described scenario would crop up, combat in Mouse Guard (and presumably other Burning Wheel system games) is resolved with the GM and players each secretly deciding on three actions before revealing them all at once and resolving the round of combat
    – Pingcode
    21 hours ago








2




2




As a useful practical example where the described scenario would crop up, combat in Mouse Guard (and presumably other Burning Wheel system games) is resolved with the GM and players each secretly deciding on three actions before revealing them all at once and resolving the round of combat
– Pingcode
21 hours ago




As a useful practical example where the described scenario would crop up, combat in Mouse Guard (and presumably other Burning Wheel system games) is resolved with the GM and players each secretly deciding on three actions before revealing them all at once and resolving the round of combat
– Pingcode
21 hours ago










8 Answers
8






active

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up vote
94
down vote













Have Alice generate and publish an SHA-256 hash of her action.



SHA-256 is a computationally-secure (to reasonable approximation) algorithm that converts a given string into an unintelligible hexadecimal hash. There are online implementations that will compute SHA256 for you, for instance, here.



The idea is this:




  1. Alice decides her action - say, "I cast Fireball at Bob"

  2. Alice privately records that exact text

  3. Alice enters that text into an SHA256 generator, producing a meaningless jumble of characters - A0FC4543FDBA266006F1F9FA818183710A8C5CA80613DA109B8A9DBA194DEC4E

  4. Alice publicly announces "I've planned an action; its SHA-256 is A0FC4543FDBA266006F1F9FA818183710A8C5CA80613DA109B8A9DBA194DEC4E"


Now, Bob cannot tell what Alice has planned because the SHA-256 is not reversible; there's no way to get from the hash back to the action.



Later, when Alice reveals her plan, she gives the exact text she prepared earlier. If Bob doesn't trust her, he can simply repeat the SHA-256 encryption, and verify that the signatures match.



If Alice suspects that Bob may guess her action, then she can make things harder by adding an extra, irrelevant component to the action before computing the SHA-256. For instance, if Alice records, signs, and later reveals "I cast Fireball at Bob (pistachio)", then Bob would not be able to guess and verify the action without also guessing the extra "(pistachio)". This is known as using a "salt".






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  • Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
    – SevenSidedDie
    14 hours ago


















up vote
8
down vote













Send the decisions to a trusted third party.



When the time comes to reveal the action, the third party will then do so.



This has the advantage of being simple and doesn't require any technological know-how.






share|improve this answer

















  • 4




    It's not simple at all, as it adds an extra communication channel for every player in the game, and replaces technological know-how with social know-how instead, something that is far less reliable. These are disadvantages!
    – Nij
    yesterday






  • 2




    This seems to count as "just relying on good faith."
    – Bloodcinder
    yesterday






  • 3




    @Nij it is simple in the fact that a high percentage of people can actually accomplish this. The problem with bring encryption schemes, etc into the picture is that few non-technical people will understand how to deal with these things.
    – Destruktor
    yesterday


















up vote
6
down vote













Use a communication system like facebook that allows you to set up visibility on each post.



Post a publicly visible post saying




Alice glances at her spell book then gestures, ready to begin casting a spell.




Post a private post saying




If X happens Alice will cast fireball at Y




If the trigger happens change the privacy of the post to public.



The timestamp and edit history should be able to show that the post has not been modified other than to change the visibility.



As V2Blast pointed out and Zac offered a solution to the public post should link to the private post to prove that it's the same post and you didn't post multiple hidden posts.



If you have a DM or similar in the game then you could also give them access to the private posts for their information.






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  • 10




    The potential issue with this is that you could just make multiple private posts with different courses of action, and just make public the one that you decide on after the fact.
    – V2Blast
    yesterday






  • 7




    @V2Blast not if you provide a link to the (currently) private post in advance - if Facebook works correctly, it shouldn't reveal the post to others until it's made public, but the url won't change
    – Zac Faragher
    yesterday












  • @ZacFaragher: Ah, interesting idea.
    – V2Blast
    yesterday


















up vote
6
down vote













An alternative to hash commitment that requires less technical knowhow: do what scientists used to do to establish priority for an idea until they were ready to publish. Instead of a SHA, publish a signature that is easily derived from the message by a human but can't be easily reversed.



One simple "signature" is just to show how many times each letter appears in the message, but not their order. Then when it's time to reveal, it's easy to verify. So Alice can sign the message




I betray Bob




as




ABBBEIORTY




One obvious problem is that for such a short, straightforward message, Bob can probably guess what is meant: there are a lot of Bs and one O, so it's probably about him. He can also rule out some possibilities he's worried about: the message clearly can't include fireball, because there's no F; but it could include betray.



Alice can prevent this by speaking somewhat more cryptically or using a few more words than necessary. If Alice publishes




AAABDDDDEEEEEFGGGHHHHHHIIIIIILLLLMMNOOOOOORRRRRSSTTTTTTTUUUWW




it's hard to guess that she means




Though allied with Robert, I grow tired of him and sell him out to the guards.




Just for fun, note that this message does leave open the possibility of a fireball (because it contains all of the letters in "FIREBALL"), in case Alice thinks that's something Bob would want to rule out.






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amalloy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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    up vote
    4
    down vote













    Trust



    This one isn't always appropriate - but if you play with a constant group of friends, then simply trusting that they are being honest is the way I usually play games. This works for me, because I don't generally play with randoms or at events outside of home.



    Obviously this won't always work - not everyone has the required integrity to resist the urge to cheat. But if you're playing a longer campaign with a consistent group, you'll learn pretty quickly using this method whether it's actually viable.



    If not, then the other methods mentioned above are steller. However, as far as simplicity and ease to implement is concerned, this is by far the easiest.






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      up vote
      3
      down vote













      This problem was already solved in the past. As exibit A, I would introduce the game "Diplomacy" which had a prolific history of play by post. In this game, 7 players needs to coordinate (and betray) each other constantly to progress the game. There are of course direct communications between players, but any move must be committed and sent to a third party "referee". The referee would receive the moves, execute and resolve them appropriately, and then publish the outcome in a public channel (usually, a magazine, plus direct paper mail to each player.)



      The only requirement here is trust with the game organizer. But why would you play if you can't trust at least the organizer?






      share|improve this answer





















      • "... why would you play if you can't trust at least the organizer?" - probably because they don't have an external organizer, and players run it collectively.
        – Nij
        8 hours ago












      • In my particular game, the gamemaster is also an adversarial player. This solution expects that the GM can be trusted on good faith, but that violates the premise of the question.
        – Bloodcinder
        6 hours ago










      • @bloodcinder no it does not, he doesn’t say the player/GM has to be the organizer/referee.
        – mxyzplk
        20 mins ago


















      up vote
      2
      down vote













      A simple resource for exactly this kind of thing is http://onetimesecret.com. It allows you to create a "secret" and publish the link to it, but once the secret has been viewed once, it is deleted, and cannot be viewed again.



      Alice enters her secret, and sends the hyperlink to Bob, but tells him not to look at it yet. Bob publicly declares his course of action, then looks at Alice's onetimesecret post. Alice can check the time at which her secret was viewed, to verify that it was after Bob's public declaration.



      This way, Alice can't lie about her decision, but Bob won't know what it was until after he declares his course of action.



      (Note: I am not affiliated in any way with onetimesecret.com. I just find it a useful resource.)






      share|improve this answer








      New contributor




      GentlePurpleRain is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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        up vote
        -2
        down vote














        1. Alice make decision message -> [D]



        2. Encrypt [D] with random private key [PK], make cryptogram -> [C]



          Lots of algorithms can be used here.



        3. Send [C] to Bob.


        4. When event have to occur, Bob request [PK] from Alice.



        5. Alice Send [PK], Bob can translate [C]->[D]



          it is hard to make [C] to desired other decision message[D2] with other [PK2]




        Show programmer in your team this sequence. He will understand if he have learn.






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        • 5




          And if there's no programmer available, how does this help anybody? The answer seems to be a much worse version of the answer posted by Chowlett hours ago.
          – Nij
          yesterday






        • 1




          There are existing tools for this. Which one did you use when you played this kind of game?
          – SevenSidedDie
          14 hours ago













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        8 Answers
        8






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        8 Answers
        8






        active

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        up vote
        94
        down vote













        Have Alice generate and publish an SHA-256 hash of her action.



        SHA-256 is a computationally-secure (to reasonable approximation) algorithm that converts a given string into an unintelligible hexadecimal hash. There are online implementations that will compute SHA256 for you, for instance, here.



        The idea is this:




        1. Alice decides her action - say, "I cast Fireball at Bob"

        2. Alice privately records that exact text

        3. Alice enters that text into an SHA256 generator, producing a meaningless jumble of characters - A0FC4543FDBA266006F1F9FA818183710A8C5CA80613DA109B8A9DBA194DEC4E

        4. Alice publicly announces "I've planned an action; its SHA-256 is A0FC4543FDBA266006F1F9FA818183710A8C5CA80613DA109B8A9DBA194DEC4E"


        Now, Bob cannot tell what Alice has planned because the SHA-256 is not reversible; there's no way to get from the hash back to the action.



        Later, when Alice reveals her plan, she gives the exact text she prepared earlier. If Bob doesn't trust her, he can simply repeat the SHA-256 encryption, and verify that the signatures match.



        If Alice suspects that Bob may guess her action, then she can make things harder by adding an extra, irrelevant component to the action before computing the SHA-256. For instance, if Alice records, signs, and later reveals "I cast Fireball at Bob (pistachio)", then Bob would not be able to guess and verify the action without also guessing the extra "(pistachio)". This is known as using a "salt".






        share|improve this answer





















        • Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
          – SevenSidedDie
          14 hours ago















        up vote
        94
        down vote













        Have Alice generate and publish an SHA-256 hash of her action.



        SHA-256 is a computationally-secure (to reasonable approximation) algorithm that converts a given string into an unintelligible hexadecimal hash. There are online implementations that will compute SHA256 for you, for instance, here.



        The idea is this:




        1. Alice decides her action - say, "I cast Fireball at Bob"

        2. Alice privately records that exact text

        3. Alice enters that text into an SHA256 generator, producing a meaningless jumble of characters - A0FC4543FDBA266006F1F9FA818183710A8C5CA80613DA109B8A9DBA194DEC4E

        4. Alice publicly announces "I've planned an action; its SHA-256 is A0FC4543FDBA266006F1F9FA818183710A8C5CA80613DA109B8A9DBA194DEC4E"


        Now, Bob cannot tell what Alice has planned because the SHA-256 is not reversible; there's no way to get from the hash back to the action.



        Later, when Alice reveals her plan, she gives the exact text she prepared earlier. If Bob doesn't trust her, he can simply repeat the SHA-256 encryption, and verify that the signatures match.



        If Alice suspects that Bob may guess her action, then she can make things harder by adding an extra, irrelevant component to the action before computing the SHA-256. For instance, if Alice records, signs, and later reveals "I cast Fireball at Bob (pistachio)", then Bob would not be able to guess and verify the action without also guessing the extra "(pistachio)". This is known as using a "salt".






        share|improve this answer





















        • Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
          – SevenSidedDie
          14 hours ago













        up vote
        94
        down vote










        up vote
        94
        down vote









        Have Alice generate and publish an SHA-256 hash of her action.



        SHA-256 is a computationally-secure (to reasonable approximation) algorithm that converts a given string into an unintelligible hexadecimal hash. There are online implementations that will compute SHA256 for you, for instance, here.



        The idea is this:




        1. Alice decides her action - say, "I cast Fireball at Bob"

        2. Alice privately records that exact text

        3. Alice enters that text into an SHA256 generator, producing a meaningless jumble of characters - A0FC4543FDBA266006F1F9FA818183710A8C5CA80613DA109B8A9DBA194DEC4E

        4. Alice publicly announces "I've planned an action; its SHA-256 is A0FC4543FDBA266006F1F9FA818183710A8C5CA80613DA109B8A9DBA194DEC4E"


        Now, Bob cannot tell what Alice has planned because the SHA-256 is not reversible; there's no way to get from the hash back to the action.



        Later, when Alice reveals her plan, she gives the exact text she prepared earlier. If Bob doesn't trust her, he can simply repeat the SHA-256 encryption, and verify that the signatures match.



        If Alice suspects that Bob may guess her action, then she can make things harder by adding an extra, irrelevant component to the action before computing the SHA-256. For instance, if Alice records, signs, and later reveals "I cast Fireball at Bob (pistachio)", then Bob would not be able to guess and verify the action without also guessing the extra "(pistachio)". This is known as using a "salt".






        share|improve this answer












        Have Alice generate and publish an SHA-256 hash of her action.



        SHA-256 is a computationally-secure (to reasonable approximation) algorithm that converts a given string into an unintelligible hexadecimal hash. There are online implementations that will compute SHA256 for you, for instance, here.



        The idea is this:




        1. Alice decides her action - say, "I cast Fireball at Bob"

        2. Alice privately records that exact text

        3. Alice enters that text into an SHA256 generator, producing a meaningless jumble of characters - A0FC4543FDBA266006F1F9FA818183710A8C5CA80613DA109B8A9DBA194DEC4E

        4. Alice publicly announces "I've planned an action; its SHA-256 is A0FC4543FDBA266006F1F9FA818183710A8C5CA80613DA109B8A9DBA194DEC4E"


        Now, Bob cannot tell what Alice has planned because the SHA-256 is not reversible; there's no way to get from the hash back to the action.



        Later, when Alice reveals her plan, she gives the exact text she prepared earlier. If Bob doesn't trust her, he can simply repeat the SHA-256 encryption, and verify that the signatures match.



        If Alice suspects that Bob may guess her action, then she can make things harder by adding an extra, irrelevant component to the action before computing the SHA-256. For instance, if Alice records, signs, and later reveals "I cast Fireball at Bob (pistachio)", then Bob would not be able to guess and verify the action without also guessing the extra "(pistachio)". This is known as using a "salt".







        share|improve this answer












        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer










        answered yesterday









        Chowlett

        63159




        63159












        • Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
          – SevenSidedDie
          14 hours ago


















        • Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
          – SevenSidedDie
          14 hours ago
















        Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
        – SevenSidedDie
        14 hours ago




        Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
        – SevenSidedDie
        14 hours ago












        up vote
        8
        down vote













        Send the decisions to a trusted third party.



        When the time comes to reveal the action, the third party will then do so.



        This has the advantage of being simple and doesn't require any technological know-how.






        share|improve this answer

















        • 4




          It's not simple at all, as it adds an extra communication channel for every player in the game, and replaces technological know-how with social know-how instead, something that is far less reliable. These are disadvantages!
          – Nij
          yesterday






        • 2




          This seems to count as "just relying on good faith."
          – Bloodcinder
          yesterday






        • 3




          @Nij it is simple in the fact that a high percentage of people can actually accomplish this. The problem with bring encryption schemes, etc into the picture is that few non-technical people will understand how to deal with these things.
          – Destruktor
          yesterday















        up vote
        8
        down vote













        Send the decisions to a trusted third party.



        When the time comes to reveal the action, the third party will then do so.



        This has the advantage of being simple and doesn't require any technological know-how.






        share|improve this answer

















        • 4




          It's not simple at all, as it adds an extra communication channel for every player in the game, and replaces technological know-how with social know-how instead, something that is far less reliable. These are disadvantages!
          – Nij
          yesterday






        • 2




          This seems to count as "just relying on good faith."
          – Bloodcinder
          yesterday






        • 3




          @Nij it is simple in the fact that a high percentage of people can actually accomplish this. The problem with bring encryption schemes, etc into the picture is that few non-technical people will understand how to deal with these things.
          – Destruktor
          yesterday













        up vote
        8
        down vote










        up vote
        8
        down vote









        Send the decisions to a trusted third party.



        When the time comes to reveal the action, the third party will then do so.



        This has the advantage of being simple and doesn't require any technological know-how.






        share|improve this answer












        Send the decisions to a trusted third party.



        When the time comes to reveal the action, the third party will then do so.



        This has the advantage of being simple and doesn't require any technological know-how.







        share|improve this answer












        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer










        answered yesterday









        Destruktor

        2,0791443




        2,0791443








        • 4




          It's not simple at all, as it adds an extra communication channel for every player in the game, and replaces technological know-how with social know-how instead, something that is far less reliable. These are disadvantages!
          – Nij
          yesterday






        • 2




          This seems to count as "just relying on good faith."
          – Bloodcinder
          yesterday






        • 3




          @Nij it is simple in the fact that a high percentage of people can actually accomplish this. The problem with bring encryption schemes, etc into the picture is that few non-technical people will understand how to deal with these things.
          – Destruktor
          yesterday














        • 4




          It's not simple at all, as it adds an extra communication channel for every player in the game, and replaces technological know-how with social know-how instead, something that is far less reliable. These are disadvantages!
          – Nij
          yesterday






        • 2




          This seems to count as "just relying on good faith."
          – Bloodcinder
          yesterday






        • 3




          @Nij it is simple in the fact that a high percentage of people can actually accomplish this. The problem with bring encryption schemes, etc into the picture is that few non-technical people will understand how to deal with these things.
          – Destruktor
          yesterday








        4




        4




        It's not simple at all, as it adds an extra communication channel for every player in the game, and replaces technological know-how with social know-how instead, something that is far less reliable. These are disadvantages!
        – Nij
        yesterday




        It's not simple at all, as it adds an extra communication channel for every player in the game, and replaces technological know-how with social know-how instead, something that is far less reliable. These are disadvantages!
        – Nij
        yesterday




        2




        2




        This seems to count as "just relying on good faith."
        – Bloodcinder
        yesterday




        This seems to count as "just relying on good faith."
        – Bloodcinder
        yesterday




        3




        3




        @Nij it is simple in the fact that a high percentage of people can actually accomplish this. The problem with bring encryption schemes, etc into the picture is that few non-technical people will understand how to deal with these things.
        – Destruktor
        yesterday




        @Nij it is simple in the fact that a high percentage of people can actually accomplish this. The problem with bring encryption schemes, etc into the picture is that few non-technical people will understand how to deal with these things.
        – Destruktor
        yesterday










        up vote
        6
        down vote













        Use a communication system like facebook that allows you to set up visibility on each post.



        Post a publicly visible post saying




        Alice glances at her spell book then gestures, ready to begin casting a spell.




        Post a private post saying




        If X happens Alice will cast fireball at Y




        If the trigger happens change the privacy of the post to public.



        The timestamp and edit history should be able to show that the post has not been modified other than to change the visibility.



        As V2Blast pointed out and Zac offered a solution to the public post should link to the private post to prove that it's the same post and you didn't post multiple hidden posts.



        If you have a DM or similar in the game then you could also give them access to the private posts for their information.






        share|improve this answer



















        • 10




          The potential issue with this is that you could just make multiple private posts with different courses of action, and just make public the one that you decide on after the fact.
          – V2Blast
          yesterday






        • 7




          @V2Blast not if you provide a link to the (currently) private post in advance - if Facebook works correctly, it shouldn't reveal the post to others until it's made public, but the url won't change
          – Zac Faragher
          yesterday












        • @ZacFaragher: Ah, interesting idea.
          – V2Blast
          yesterday















        up vote
        6
        down vote













        Use a communication system like facebook that allows you to set up visibility on each post.



        Post a publicly visible post saying




        Alice glances at her spell book then gestures, ready to begin casting a spell.




        Post a private post saying




        If X happens Alice will cast fireball at Y




        If the trigger happens change the privacy of the post to public.



        The timestamp and edit history should be able to show that the post has not been modified other than to change the visibility.



        As V2Blast pointed out and Zac offered a solution to the public post should link to the private post to prove that it's the same post and you didn't post multiple hidden posts.



        If you have a DM or similar in the game then you could also give them access to the private posts for their information.






        share|improve this answer



















        • 10




          The potential issue with this is that you could just make multiple private posts with different courses of action, and just make public the one that you decide on after the fact.
          – V2Blast
          yesterday






        • 7




          @V2Blast not if you provide a link to the (currently) private post in advance - if Facebook works correctly, it shouldn't reveal the post to others until it's made public, but the url won't change
          – Zac Faragher
          yesterday












        • @ZacFaragher: Ah, interesting idea.
          – V2Blast
          yesterday













        up vote
        6
        down vote










        up vote
        6
        down vote









        Use a communication system like facebook that allows you to set up visibility on each post.



        Post a publicly visible post saying




        Alice glances at her spell book then gestures, ready to begin casting a spell.




        Post a private post saying




        If X happens Alice will cast fireball at Y




        If the trigger happens change the privacy of the post to public.



        The timestamp and edit history should be able to show that the post has not been modified other than to change the visibility.



        As V2Blast pointed out and Zac offered a solution to the public post should link to the private post to prove that it's the same post and you didn't post multiple hidden posts.



        If you have a DM or similar in the game then you could also give them access to the private posts for their information.






        share|improve this answer














        Use a communication system like facebook that allows you to set up visibility on each post.



        Post a publicly visible post saying




        Alice glances at her spell book then gestures, ready to begin casting a spell.




        Post a private post saying




        If X happens Alice will cast fireball at Y




        If the trigger happens change the privacy of the post to public.



        The timestamp and edit history should be able to show that the post has not been modified other than to change the visibility.



        As V2Blast pointed out and Zac offered a solution to the public post should link to the private post to prove that it's the same post and you didn't post multiple hidden posts.



        If you have a DM or similar in the game then you could also give them access to the private posts for their information.







        share|improve this answer














        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer








        edited 20 hours ago

























        answered yesterday









        Tim B

        5,2061246




        5,2061246








        • 10




          The potential issue with this is that you could just make multiple private posts with different courses of action, and just make public the one that you decide on after the fact.
          – V2Blast
          yesterday






        • 7




          @V2Blast not if you provide a link to the (currently) private post in advance - if Facebook works correctly, it shouldn't reveal the post to others until it's made public, but the url won't change
          – Zac Faragher
          yesterday












        • @ZacFaragher: Ah, interesting idea.
          – V2Blast
          yesterday














        • 10




          The potential issue with this is that you could just make multiple private posts with different courses of action, and just make public the one that you decide on after the fact.
          – V2Blast
          yesterday






        • 7




          @V2Blast not if you provide a link to the (currently) private post in advance - if Facebook works correctly, it shouldn't reveal the post to others until it's made public, but the url won't change
          – Zac Faragher
          yesterday












        • @ZacFaragher: Ah, interesting idea.
          – V2Blast
          yesterday








        10




        10




        The potential issue with this is that you could just make multiple private posts with different courses of action, and just make public the one that you decide on after the fact.
        – V2Blast
        yesterday




        The potential issue with this is that you could just make multiple private posts with different courses of action, and just make public the one that you decide on after the fact.
        – V2Blast
        yesterday




        7




        7




        @V2Blast not if you provide a link to the (currently) private post in advance - if Facebook works correctly, it shouldn't reveal the post to others until it's made public, but the url won't change
        – Zac Faragher
        yesterday






        @V2Blast not if you provide a link to the (currently) private post in advance - if Facebook works correctly, it shouldn't reveal the post to others until it's made public, but the url won't change
        – Zac Faragher
        yesterday














        @ZacFaragher: Ah, interesting idea.
        – V2Blast
        yesterday




        @ZacFaragher: Ah, interesting idea.
        – V2Blast
        yesterday










        up vote
        6
        down vote













        An alternative to hash commitment that requires less technical knowhow: do what scientists used to do to establish priority for an idea until they were ready to publish. Instead of a SHA, publish a signature that is easily derived from the message by a human but can't be easily reversed.



        One simple "signature" is just to show how many times each letter appears in the message, but not their order. Then when it's time to reveal, it's easy to verify. So Alice can sign the message




        I betray Bob




        as




        ABBBEIORTY




        One obvious problem is that for such a short, straightforward message, Bob can probably guess what is meant: there are a lot of Bs and one O, so it's probably about him. He can also rule out some possibilities he's worried about: the message clearly can't include fireball, because there's no F; but it could include betray.



        Alice can prevent this by speaking somewhat more cryptically or using a few more words than necessary. If Alice publishes




        AAABDDDDEEEEEFGGGHHHHHHIIIIIILLLLMMNOOOOOORRRRRSSTTTTTTTUUUWW




        it's hard to guess that she means




        Though allied with Robert, I grow tired of him and sell him out to the guards.




        Just for fun, note that this message does leave open the possibility of a fireball (because it contains all of the letters in "FIREBALL"), in case Alice thinks that's something Bob would want to rule out.






        share|improve this answer










        New contributor




        amalloy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.






















          up vote
          6
          down vote













          An alternative to hash commitment that requires less technical knowhow: do what scientists used to do to establish priority for an idea until they were ready to publish. Instead of a SHA, publish a signature that is easily derived from the message by a human but can't be easily reversed.



          One simple "signature" is just to show how many times each letter appears in the message, but not their order. Then when it's time to reveal, it's easy to verify. So Alice can sign the message




          I betray Bob




          as




          ABBBEIORTY




          One obvious problem is that for such a short, straightforward message, Bob can probably guess what is meant: there are a lot of Bs and one O, so it's probably about him. He can also rule out some possibilities he's worried about: the message clearly can't include fireball, because there's no F; but it could include betray.



          Alice can prevent this by speaking somewhat more cryptically or using a few more words than necessary. If Alice publishes




          AAABDDDDEEEEEFGGGHHHHHHIIIIIILLLLMMNOOOOOORRRRRSSTTTTTTTUUUWW




          it's hard to guess that she means




          Though allied with Robert, I grow tired of him and sell him out to the guards.




          Just for fun, note that this message does leave open the possibility of a fireball (because it contains all of the letters in "FIREBALL"), in case Alice thinks that's something Bob would want to rule out.






          share|improve this answer










          New contributor




          amalloy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.




















            up vote
            6
            down vote










            up vote
            6
            down vote









            An alternative to hash commitment that requires less technical knowhow: do what scientists used to do to establish priority for an idea until they were ready to publish. Instead of a SHA, publish a signature that is easily derived from the message by a human but can't be easily reversed.



            One simple "signature" is just to show how many times each letter appears in the message, but not their order. Then when it's time to reveal, it's easy to verify. So Alice can sign the message




            I betray Bob




            as




            ABBBEIORTY




            One obvious problem is that for such a short, straightforward message, Bob can probably guess what is meant: there are a lot of Bs and one O, so it's probably about him. He can also rule out some possibilities he's worried about: the message clearly can't include fireball, because there's no F; but it could include betray.



            Alice can prevent this by speaking somewhat more cryptically or using a few more words than necessary. If Alice publishes




            AAABDDDDEEEEEFGGGHHHHHHIIIIIILLLLMMNOOOOOORRRRRSSTTTTTTTUUUWW




            it's hard to guess that she means




            Though allied with Robert, I grow tired of him and sell him out to the guards.




            Just for fun, note that this message does leave open the possibility of a fireball (because it contains all of the letters in "FIREBALL"), in case Alice thinks that's something Bob would want to rule out.






            share|improve this answer










            New contributor




            amalloy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.









            An alternative to hash commitment that requires less technical knowhow: do what scientists used to do to establish priority for an idea until they were ready to publish. Instead of a SHA, publish a signature that is easily derived from the message by a human but can't be easily reversed.



            One simple "signature" is just to show how many times each letter appears in the message, but not their order. Then when it's time to reveal, it's easy to verify. So Alice can sign the message




            I betray Bob




            as




            ABBBEIORTY




            One obvious problem is that for such a short, straightforward message, Bob can probably guess what is meant: there are a lot of Bs and one O, so it's probably about him. He can also rule out some possibilities he's worried about: the message clearly can't include fireball, because there's no F; but it could include betray.



            Alice can prevent this by speaking somewhat more cryptically or using a few more words than necessary. If Alice publishes




            AAABDDDDEEEEEFGGGHHHHHHIIIIIILLLLMMNOOOOOORRRRRSSTTTTTTTUUUWW




            it's hard to guess that she means




            Though allied with Robert, I grow tired of him and sell him out to the guards.




            Just for fun, note that this message does leave open the possibility of a fireball (because it contains all of the letters in "FIREBALL"), in case Alice thinks that's something Bob would want to rule out.







            share|improve this answer










            New contributor




            amalloy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.









            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer








            edited 14 hours ago









            Ben Bolker

            1033




            1033






            New contributor




            amalloy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.









            answered yesterday









            amalloy

            1634




            1634




            New contributor




            amalloy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.





            New contributor





            amalloy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.






            amalloy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.






















                up vote
                4
                down vote













                Trust



                This one isn't always appropriate - but if you play with a constant group of friends, then simply trusting that they are being honest is the way I usually play games. This works for me, because I don't generally play with randoms or at events outside of home.



                Obviously this won't always work - not everyone has the required integrity to resist the urge to cheat. But if you're playing a longer campaign with a consistent group, you'll learn pretty quickly using this method whether it's actually viable.



                If not, then the other methods mentioned above are steller. However, as far as simplicity and ease to implement is concerned, this is by far the easiest.






                share|improve this answer

























                  up vote
                  4
                  down vote













                  Trust



                  This one isn't always appropriate - but if you play with a constant group of friends, then simply trusting that they are being honest is the way I usually play games. This works for me, because I don't generally play with randoms or at events outside of home.



                  Obviously this won't always work - not everyone has the required integrity to resist the urge to cheat. But if you're playing a longer campaign with a consistent group, you'll learn pretty quickly using this method whether it's actually viable.



                  If not, then the other methods mentioned above are steller. However, as far as simplicity and ease to implement is concerned, this is by far the easiest.






                  share|improve this answer























                    up vote
                    4
                    down vote










                    up vote
                    4
                    down vote









                    Trust



                    This one isn't always appropriate - but if you play with a constant group of friends, then simply trusting that they are being honest is the way I usually play games. This works for me, because I don't generally play with randoms or at events outside of home.



                    Obviously this won't always work - not everyone has the required integrity to resist the urge to cheat. But if you're playing a longer campaign with a consistent group, you'll learn pretty quickly using this method whether it's actually viable.



                    If not, then the other methods mentioned above are steller. However, as far as simplicity and ease to implement is concerned, this is by far the easiest.






                    share|improve this answer












                    Trust



                    This one isn't always appropriate - but if you play with a constant group of friends, then simply trusting that they are being honest is the way I usually play games. This works for me, because I don't generally play with randoms or at events outside of home.



                    Obviously this won't always work - not everyone has the required integrity to resist the urge to cheat. But if you're playing a longer campaign with a consistent group, you'll learn pretty quickly using this method whether it's actually viable.



                    If not, then the other methods mentioned above are steller. However, as far as simplicity and ease to implement is concerned, this is by far the easiest.







                    share|improve this answer












                    share|improve this answer



                    share|improve this answer










                    answered yesterday









                    Shadow

                    386112




                    386112






















                        up vote
                        3
                        down vote













                        This problem was already solved in the past. As exibit A, I would introduce the game "Diplomacy" which had a prolific history of play by post. In this game, 7 players needs to coordinate (and betray) each other constantly to progress the game. There are of course direct communications between players, but any move must be committed and sent to a third party "referee". The referee would receive the moves, execute and resolve them appropriately, and then publish the outcome in a public channel (usually, a magazine, plus direct paper mail to each player.)



                        The only requirement here is trust with the game organizer. But why would you play if you can't trust at least the organizer?






                        share|improve this answer





















                        • "... why would you play if you can't trust at least the organizer?" - probably because they don't have an external organizer, and players run it collectively.
                          – Nij
                          8 hours ago












                        • In my particular game, the gamemaster is also an adversarial player. This solution expects that the GM can be trusted on good faith, but that violates the premise of the question.
                          – Bloodcinder
                          6 hours ago










                        • @bloodcinder no it does not, he doesn’t say the player/GM has to be the organizer/referee.
                          – mxyzplk
                          20 mins ago















                        up vote
                        3
                        down vote













                        This problem was already solved in the past. As exibit A, I would introduce the game "Diplomacy" which had a prolific history of play by post. In this game, 7 players needs to coordinate (and betray) each other constantly to progress the game. There are of course direct communications between players, but any move must be committed and sent to a third party "referee". The referee would receive the moves, execute and resolve them appropriately, and then publish the outcome in a public channel (usually, a magazine, plus direct paper mail to each player.)



                        The only requirement here is trust with the game organizer. But why would you play if you can't trust at least the organizer?






                        share|improve this answer





















                        • "... why would you play if you can't trust at least the organizer?" - probably because they don't have an external organizer, and players run it collectively.
                          – Nij
                          8 hours ago












                        • In my particular game, the gamemaster is also an adversarial player. This solution expects that the GM can be trusted on good faith, but that violates the premise of the question.
                          – Bloodcinder
                          6 hours ago










                        • @bloodcinder no it does not, he doesn’t say the player/GM has to be the organizer/referee.
                          – mxyzplk
                          20 mins ago













                        up vote
                        3
                        down vote










                        up vote
                        3
                        down vote









                        This problem was already solved in the past. As exibit A, I would introduce the game "Diplomacy" which had a prolific history of play by post. In this game, 7 players needs to coordinate (and betray) each other constantly to progress the game. There are of course direct communications between players, but any move must be committed and sent to a third party "referee". The referee would receive the moves, execute and resolve them appropriately, and then publish the outcome in a public channel (usually, a magazine, plus direct paper mail to each player.)



                        The only requirement here is trust with the game organizer. But why would you play if you can't trust at least the organizer?






                        share|improve this answer












                        This problem was already solved in the past. As exibit A, I would introduce the game "Diplomacy" which had a prolific history of play by post. In this game, 7 players needs to coordinate (and betray) each other constantly to progress the game. There are of course direct communications between players, but any move must be committed and sent to a third party "referee". The referee would receive the moves, execute and resolve them appropriately, and then publish the outcome in a public channel (usually, a magazine, plus direct paper mail to each player.)



                        The only requirement here is trust with the game organizer. But why would you play if you can't trust at least the organizer?







                        share|improve this answer












                        share|improve this answer



                        share|improve this answer










                        answered 21 hours ago









                        STT LCU

                        423417




                        423417












                        • "... why would you play if you can't trust at least the organizer?" - probably because they don't have an external organizer, and players run it collectively.
                          – Nij
                          8 hours ago












                        • In my particular game, the gamemaster is also an adversarial player. This solution expects that the GM can be trusted on good faith, but that violates the premise of the question.
                          – Bloodcinder
                          6 hours ago










                        • @bloodcinder no it does not, he doesn’t say the player/GM has to be the organizer/referee.
                          – mxyzplk
                          20 mins ago


















                        • "... why would you play if you can't trust at least the organizer?" - probably because they don't have an external organizer, and players run it collectively.
                          – Nij
                          8 hours ago












                        • In my particular game, the gamemaster is also an adversarial player. This solution expects that the GM can be trusted on good faith, but that violates the premise of the question.
                          – Bloodcinder
                          6 hours ago










                        • @bloodcinder no it does not, he doesn’t say the player/GM has to be the organizer/referee.
                          – mxyzplk
                          20 mins ago
















                        "... why would you play if you can't trust at least the organizer?" - probably because they don't have an external organizer, and players run it collectively.
                        – Nij
                        8 hours ago






                        "... why would you play if you can't trust at least the organizer?" - probably because they don't have an external organizer, and players run it collectively.
                        – Nij
                        8 hours ago














                        In my particular game, the gamemaster is also an adversarial player. This solution expects that the GM can be trusted on good faith, but that violates the premise of the question.
                        – Bloodcinder
                        6 hours ago




                        In my particular game, the gamemaster is also an adversarial player. This solution expects that the GM can be trusted on good faith, but that violates the premise of the question.
                        – Bloodcinder
                        6 hours ago












                        @bloodcinder no it does not, he doesn’t say the player/GM has to be the organizer/referee.
                        – mxyzplk
                        20 mins ago




                        @bloodcinder no it does not, he doesn’t say the player/GM has to be the organizer/referee.
                        – mxyzplk
                        20 mins ago










                        up vote
                        2
                        down vote













                        A simple resource for exactly this kind of thing is http://onetimesecret.com. It allows you to create a "secret" and publish the link to it, but once the secret has been viewed once, it is deleted, and cannot be viewed again.



                        Alice enters her secret, and sends the hyperlink to Bob, but tells him not to look at it yet. Bob publicly declares his course of action, then looks at Alice's onetimesecret post. Alice can check the time at which her secret was viewed, to verify that it was after Bob's public declaration.



                        This way, Alice can't lie about her decision, but Bob won't know what it was until after he declares his course of action.



                        (Note: I am not affiliated in any way with onetimesecret.com. I just find it a useful resource.)






                        share|improve this answer








                        New contributor




                        GentlePurpleRain is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                        Check out our Code of Conduct.






















                          up vote
                          2
                          down vote













                          A simple resource for exactly this kind of thing is http://onetimesecret.com. It allows you to create a "secret" and publish the link to it, but once the secret has been viewed once, it is deleted, and cannot be viewed again.



                          Alice enters her secret, and sends the hyperlink to Bob, but tells him not to look at it yet. Bob publicly declares his course of action, then looks at Alice's onetimesecret post. Alice can check the time at which her secret was viewed, to verify that it was after Bob's public declaration.



                          This way, Alice can't lie about her decision, but Bob won't know what it was until after he declares his course of action.



                          (Note: I am not affiliated in any way with onetimesecret.com. I just find it a useful resource.)






                          share|improve this answer








                          New contributor




                          GentlePurpleRain is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                          Check out our Code of Conduct.




















                            up vote
                            2
                            down vote










                            up vote
                            2
                            down vote









                            A simple resource for exactly this kind of thing is http://onetimesecret.com. It allows you to create a "secret" and publish the link to it, but once the secret has been viewed once, it is deleted, and cannot be viewed again.



                            Alice enters her secret, and sends the hyperlink to Bob, but tells him not to look at it yet. Bob publicly declares his course of action, then looks at Alice's onetimesecret post. Alice can check the time at which her secret was viewed, to verify that it was after Bob's public declaration.



                            This way, Alice can't lie about her decision, but Bob won't know what it was until after he declares his course of action.



                            (Note: I am not affiliated in any way with onetimesecret.com. I just find it a useful resource.)






                            share|improve this answer








                            New contributor




                            GentlePurpleRain is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                            Check out our Code of Conduct.









                            A simple resource for exactly this kind of thing is http://onetimesecret.com. It allows you to create a "secret" and publish the link to it, but once the secret has been viewed once, it is deleted, and cannot be viewed again.



                            Alice enters her secret, and sends the hyperlink to Bob, but tells him not to look at it yet. Bob publicly declares his course of action, then looks at Alice's onetimesecret post. Alice can check the time at which her secret was viewed, to verify that it was after Bob's public declaration.



                            This way, Alice can't lie about her decision, but Bob won't know what it was until after he declares his course of action.



                            (Note: I am not affiliated in any way with onetimesecret.com. I just find it a useful resource.)







                            share|improve this answer








                            New contributor




                            GentlePurpleRain is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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                            share|improve this answer



                            share|improve this answer






                            New contributor




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                            answered 10 hours ago









                            GentlePurpleRain

                            1212




                            1212




                            New contributor




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                            New contributor





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                                up vote
                                -2
                                down vote














                                1. Alice make decision message -> [D]



                                2. Encrypt [D] with random private key [PK], make cryptogram -> [C]



                                  Lots of algorithms can be used here.



                                3. Send [C] to Bob.


                                4. When event have to occur, Bob request [PK] from Alice.



                                5. Alice Send [PK], Bob can translate [C]->[D]



                                  it is hard to make [C] to desired other decision message[D2] with other [PK2]




                                Show programmer in your team this sequence. He will understand if he have learn.






                                share|improve this answer










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                                • 5




                                  And if there's no programmer available, how does this help anybody? The answer seems to be a much worse version of the answer posted by Chowlett hours ago.
                                  – Nij
                                  yesterday






                                • 1




                                  There are existing tools for this. Which one did you use when you played this kind of game?
                                  – SevenSidedDie
                                  14 hours ago

















                                up vote
                                -2
                                down vote














                                1. Alice make decision message -> [D]



                                2. Encrypt [D] with random private key [PK], make cryptogram -> [C]



                                  Lots of algorithms can be used here.



                                3. Send [C] to Bob.


                                4. When event have to occur, Bob request [PK] from Alice.



                                5. Alice Send [PK], Bob can translate [C]->[D]



                                  it is hard to make [C] to desired other decision message[D2] with other [PK2]




                                Show programmer in your team this sequence. He will understand if he have learn.






                                share|improve this answer










                                New contributor




                                siamenock is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.














                                • 5




                                  And if there's no programmer available, how does this help anybody? The answer seems to be a much worse version of the answer posted by Chowlett hours ago.
                                  – Nij
                                  yesterday






                                • 1




                                  There are existing tools for this. Which one did you use when you played this kind of game?
                                  – SevenSidedDie
                                  14 hours ago















                                up vote
                                -2
                                down vote










                                up vote
                                -2
                                down vote










                                1. Alice make decision message -> [D]



                                2. Encrypt [D] with random private key [PK], make cryptogram -> [C]



                                  Lots of algorithms can be used here.



                                3. Send [C] to Bob.


                                4. When event have to occur, Bob request [PK] from Alice.



                                5. Alice Send [PK], Bob can translate [C]->[D]



                                  it is hard to make [C] to desired other decision message[D2] with other [PK2]




                                Show programmer in your team this sequence. He will understand if he have learn.






                                share|improve this answer










                                New contributor




                                siamenock is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.










                                1. Alice make decision message -> [D]



                                2. Encrypt [D] with random private key [PK], make cryptogram -> [C]



                                  Lots of algorithms can be used here.



                                3. Send [C] to Bob.


                                4. When event have to occur, Bob request [PK] from Alice.



                                5. Alice Send [PK], Bob can translate [C]->[D]



                                  it is hard to make [C] to desired other decision message[D2] with other [PK2]




                                Show programmer in your team this sequence. He will understand if he have learn.







                                share|improve this answer










                                New contributor




                                siamenock is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.









                                share|improve this answer



                                share|improve this answer








                                edited yesterday









                                V2Blast

                                18.1k248114




                                18.1k248114






                                New contributor




                                siamenock is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.









                                answered yesterday









                                siamenock

                                71




                                71




                                New contributor




                                siamenock is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.





                                New contributor





                                siamenock is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.






                                siamenock is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.








                                • 5




                                  And if there's no programmer available, how does this help anybody? The answer seems to be a much worse version of the answer posted by Chowlett hours ago.
                                  – Nij
                                  yesterday






                                • 1




                                  There are existing tools for this. Which one did you use when you played this kind of game?
                                  – SevenSidedDie
                                  14 hours ago
















                                • 5




                                  And if there's no programmer available, how does this help anybody? The answer seems to be a much worse version of the answer posted by Chowlett hours ago.
                                  – Nij
                                  yesterday






                                • 1




                                  There are existing tools for this. Which one did you use when you played this kind of game?
                                  – SevenSidedDie
                                  14 hours ago










                                5




                                5




                                And if there's no programmer available, how does this help anybody? The answer seems to be a much worse version of the answer posted by Chowlett hours ago.
                                – Nij
                                yesterday




                                And if there's no programmer available, how does this help anybody? The answer seems to be a much worse version of the answer posted by Chowlett hours ago.
                                – Nij
                                yesterday




                                1




                                1




                                There are existing tools for this. Which one did you use when you played this kind of game?
                                – SevenSidedDie
                                14 hours ago






                                There are existing tools for this. Which one did you use when you played this kind of game?
                                – SevenSidedDie
                                14 hours ago




















                                 

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