Why was Gasoline still the major source of fuel in Mad Max: Fury Road?











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In Mad Max: Fury Road, why didn't they harness the solar power to run their automobile? We already know that the solar rays were still powerful as the plants in the citadel were exposed in a rotation to obtain the fresh produce.










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    reddit.com/r/AskScienceFiction/comments/37uwms/…
    – BCdotWEB
    13 hours ago










  • How would one harness solar power to run an automobile after the apocalypse happens, given that solar power is not a fuel that will run a combustion engine. If I tried to write the percentage of production cars that are solar vs. petroleum, I think I'd run out of zeros.
    – Mazura
    42 mins ago















up vote
13
down vote

favorite












In Mad Max: Fury Road, why didn't they harness the solar power to run their automobile? We already know that the solar rays were still powerful as the plants in the citadel were exposed in a rotation to obtain the fresh produce.










share|improve this question




















  • 2




    reddit.com/r/AskScienceFiction/comments/37uwms/…
    – BCdotWEB
    13 hours ago










  • How would one harness solar power to run an automobile after the apocalypse happens, given that solar power is not a fuel that will run a combustion engine. If I tried to write the percentage of production cars that are solar vs. petroleum, I think I'd run out of zeros.
    – Mazura
    42 mins ago













up vote
13
down vote

favorite









up vote
13
down vote

favorite











In Mad Max: Fury Road, why didn't they harness the solar power to run their automobile? We already know that the solar rays were still powerful as the plants in the citadel were exposed in a rotation to obtain the fresh produce.










share|improve this question















In Mad Max: Fury Road, why didn't they harness the solar power to run their automobile? We already know that the solar rays were still powerful as the plants in the citadel were exposed in a rotation to obtain the fresh produce.







plot-explanation analysis mad-max-fury-road






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edited 13 hours ago









BCdotWEB

26.4k478118




26.4k478118










asked 14 hours ago









war_Hero

8621723




8621723








  • 2




    reddit.com/r/AskScienceFiction/comments/37uwms/…
    – BCdotWEB
    13 hours ago










  • How would one harness solar power to run an automobile after the apocalypse happens, given that solar power is not a fuel that will run a combustion engine. If I tried to write the percentage of production cars that are solar vs. petroleum, I think I'd run out of zeros.
    – Mazura
    42 mins ago














  • 2




    reddit.com/r/AskScienceFiction/comments/37uwms/…
    – BCdotWEB
    13 hours ago










  • How would one harness solar power to run an automobile after the apocalypse happens, given that solar power is not a fuel that will run a combustion engine. If I tried to write the percentage of production cars that are solar vs. petroleum, I think I'd run out of zeros.
    – Mazura
    42 mins ago








2




2




reddit.com/r/AskScienceFiction/comments/37uwms/…
– BCdotWEB
13 hours ago




reddit.com/r/AskScienceFiction/comments/37uwms/…
– BCdotWEB
13 hours ago












How would one harness solar power to run an automobile after the apocalypse happens, given that solar power is not a fuel that will run a combustion engine. If I tried to write the percentage of production cars that are solar vs. petroleum, I think I'd run out of zeros.
– Mazura
42 mins ago




How would one harness solar power to run an automobile after the apocalypse happens, given that solar power is not a fuel that will run a combustion engine. If I tried to write the percentage of production cars that are solar vs. petroleum, I think I'd run out of zeros.
– Mazura
42 mins ago










2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes

















up vote
18
down vote













There are various aspect to this. But lets first start with some possible in-universe explanations:




  • First of all gasoline (or "guzzoline") is heavily ingrained in the culture of the War Boys. While it is more the raw power of cars they are about (with things like the valhalla spray, character names like "Organic Mechanic" for the doctor and imagery like Max being used as a living radiator mascot), this "horse power machismo" just doesn't work as well without fossil fuel.


  • They might not even have the technology or know-how to harness solar energy anymore, as their technology seems largely old and scavanged (okay, bionic arms nothwithstanding ;-)). But even then their cars are also largely reassembled scrapyard cars and it might very well be that they just didn't have the ability or willingness to completely redesign their engines for solar ectricity.


  • While they seem to be quite inventive, there might also not be much of a motivation for that either, since fuel does actually seem to exist in sufficient amount. Now it's true the smaller tribes (who in turn might lack solar technology) are fighting for every last drop of fuel, but it's also apparent that Joe's War Boys seem to have a good economy going with the guys over at Gas Town and there could very well be a resistance to overthrow that established economy and the other poltical advatages it brings (not all too dissimilar to the economic resistance the abandoning of fossil fuels is facing in our present time).



And this also leads to a larger aspect of all this. There generally seems to be a resistance to abandon the old ways, the ways that ultimately led to the downfall of the world as it is in Fury Road (or earlier films too). This whole "who killed the world" mantra and the archaic War Boy culture of Immortan Joe seems to be somewhat of a statement against the warlord machismo that supposedly made people destroy the world with their fights over fossil fuels. Granted, this is all only hinted in the film (elaborated a little in this related question and its answers), but the fight over fuel is a major aspect of many of the Mad Max films and it doesn't take much to take that as a parable of the state of our world and the way it's headed. It's no accident that Wolfgang M. Schmitt Jr. even compares the imagery of the world as presented in Fury Road to Werner Herzog's Lessons of Darkness (about the Kuwaitian oil fires) in his analysis of the film (unfortunately not available in English).



This, last but not not least, brings us directly to the massive role that gasoline and its associated themes plays for the entire Mad Max mythos. Those films are about motion, cars and raw horse power as much as (or even more than) they are about Max himself. From the very first film that has the police battle gangs in muscle cars, over the 2nd one centred aound a small enclave of humans trying to protect their only gas truck as a symbol of hope for the future. Though, the 3rd did actually reference a shift towards a replacement for gas (still, not electric rather than just bio-generated carbon fuel). The 2nd and 3rd film also end with a massive multi-car chase, a concept that Fury Road not only continued but basically extended to the entire movie.



Now you could say you could as well do car chases with Tesla Roadsters, but tell that to a man who grew up in the 80s (and Max Rockatansky is pretty much a product of the 80s, even if not diegetically) as driver of "The Last of the V8s"! These films are about raw fossil fuel force. In fact Fury Road drives this obsession to new heights with the above mentioned aspects of War Boy culture. Those films and the worlds they are depicting are obsessed with gasoline despite and because this obsession led to those worlds.






share|improve this answer























  • Not to mention that there's 100 years of intense scientific and technological development between the internal combustion engine and solar power generation. It's quite probable that society is no longer capable of manufacturing and maintaining solar panels.
    – HorusKol
    13 hours ago










  • @HorusKol Good point, added. I think I misread the question and thought it referenced existing solar panels, but it seems it doesn't.
    – Napoleon Wilson
    13 hours ago












  • I hope this answer doesn't come across as too patronizingly anti-oil, though. There still has to be a place where "real men" drive "real cars" and the Mad Max films definitely are that place. ;-)
    – Napoleon Wilson
    12 hours ago












  • No replacement for displacement!
    – SiXandSeven8ths
    10 hours ago






  • 1




    Even more than possibly lacking the solar collection technology, they may lack the battery technology. It's battery technology that limits the use of solar for vehicles even more than solar collection technology. You can't power cars directly from sunlight (there's simply not enough of it, even if you had 100% efficient panels,) so high-density batteries are required. Currently, per mass, Li metal batteries store about 1/25 of the energy of gasoline. For Li-ion batteries, it ranges from about 1/130 to 1/50. They would need battery tech at least this good, preferably better.
    – reirab
    7 hours ago


















up vote
9
down vote













Same reason we don't do more green energy today:



Batteries.



We tend to think of solar panels as things you might put on your roof to generate power for direct use but the real "off the grid" application of solar (and wind) has it going into a bank of batteries. The solar charges the batteries; the batteries run your stuff. The bigger your solar array and the more batteries you can hook up, the better.



Lead-acid batteries are pretty simple and should be within the ability of Mad Max people to create and maintain but they are heavy and their energy density is far lower than lithium batteries. Lithium batteries are complex and probably outside the technology level of Mad Max colonies (if you're familiar with the Tesla Wall, that's lithium-ion based -- high tech stuff). You can certainly run electric vehicles off of lead-acid batteries (golf carts, for instance) but the weight to power ratio of lead-acid makes them not well suited to long ranges, heavy loads or lots of fast acceleration.



Additional topics of research if you Want To Know More: battery types & electric cars; battery manufacturing; why we still use diesel for our 18-wheelers.



In short, it's easy to imagine a clean, green, electric powered colony in the Mad Max world. It's also easy to imagine them getting smashed by the War Boys because when it comes to low tech energy production, it's hard to beat gasoline. For moving heavy things or smashing an up-armored bus into your neighbor's gate after a 100 mile drive, gasoline is the way to go.



(Just as a related footnote, batteries are quieter than nuclear reactors which is why electric submarines are great. Why not switch to all electric subs? We probably would, if we could get batteries with higher energy density. Nuclear submarines can stay down much longer than electric subs, which eventually need to surface to run their diesal engines and recharge their batteries.)






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  • Nice answer. In order to get a feel for what kind of differences we're talking about here, browsing the Wikipedia page for Energy Density is helpful. In particular, lead-acid batteries have a specific energy of about 0.17 MJ/kg. Li-ion batteries range from 0.36 to 0.875. Li metal (e.g. Li-Po) is around 1.8. Gasoline is around 46 and diesel 48. Jet fuel/kerosene is around 43. So, gasoline stores 50-100 times as much energy per unit mass as Li-ion batteries and almost 300 times as much as lead-acid batteries.
    – reirab
    4 hours ago








  • 1




    Also of importance (especially in airplanes, but also in road vehicles): fuel weight burns off as the fuel is used. Battery weight remains constant as its energy is depleted. So, fossil fuels effectively get another 2x multiplier on specific energy vs. batteries on top of their already huge current advantages.
    – reirab
    4 hours ago





















2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes








2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes









active

oldest

votes






active

oldest

votes








up vote
18
down vote













There are various aspect to this. But lets first start with some possible in-universe explanations:




  • First of all gasoline (or "guzzoline") is heavily ingrained in the culture of the War Boys. While it is more the raw power of cars they are about (with things like the valhalla spray, character names like "Organic Mechanic" for the doctor and imagery like Max being used as a living radiator mascot), this "horse power machismo" just doesn't work as well without fossil fuel.


  • They might not even have the technology or know-how to harness solar energy anymore, as their technology seems largely old and scavanged (okay, bionic arms nothwithstanding ;-)). But even then their cars are also largely reassembled scrapyard cars and it might very well be that they just didn't have the ability or willingness to completely redesign their engines for solar ectricity.


  • While they seem to be quite inventive, there might also not be much of a motivation for that either, since fuel does actually seem to exist in sufficient amount. Now it's true the smaller tribes (who in turn might lack solar technology) are fighting for every last drop of fuel, but it's also apparent that Joe's War Boys seem to have a good economy going with the guys over at Gas Town and there could very well be a resistance to overthrow that established economy and the other poltical advatages it brings (not all too dissimilar to the economic resistance the abandoning of fossil fuels is facing in our present time).



And this also leads to a larger aspect of all this. There generally seems to be a resistance to abandon the old ways, the ways that ultimately led to the downfall of the world as it is in Fury Road (or earlier films too). This whole "who killed the world" mantra and the archaic War Boy culture of Immortan Joe seems to be somewhat of a statement against the warlord machismo that supposedly made people destroy the world with their fights over fossil fuels. Granted, this is all only hinted in the film (elaborated a little in this related question and its answers), but the fight over fuel is a major aspect of many of the Mad Max films and it doesn't take much to take that as a parable of the state of our world and the way it's headed. It's no accident that Wolfgang M. Schmitt Jr. even compares the imagery of the world as presented in Fury Road to Werner Herzog's Lessons of Darkness (about the Kuwaitian oil fires) in his analysis of the film (unfortunately not available in English).



This, last but not not least, brings us directly to the massive role that gasoline and its associated themes plays for the entire Mad Max mythos. Those films are about motion, cars and raw horse power as much as (or even more than) they are about Max himself. From the very first film that has the police battle gangs in muscle cars, over the 2nd one centred aound a small enclave of humans trying to protect their only gas truck as a symbol of hope for the future. Though, the 3rd did actually reference a shift towards a replacement for gas (still, not electric rather than just bio-generated carbon fuel). The 2nd and 3rd film also end with a massive multi-car chase, a concept that Fury Road not only continued but basically extended to the entire movie.



Now you could say you could as well do car chases with Tesla Roadsters, but tell that to a man who grew up in the 80s (and Max Rockatansky is pretty much a product of the 80s, even if not diegetically) as driver of "The Last of the V8s"! These films are about raw fossil fuel force. In fact Fury Road drives this obsession to new heights with the above mentioned aspects of War Boy culture. Those films and the worlds they are depicting are obsessed with gasoline despite and because this obsession led to those worlds.






share|improve this answer























  • Not to mention that there's 100 years of intense scientific and technological development between the internal combustion engine and solar power generation. It's quite probable that society is no longer capable of manufacturing and maintaining solar panels.
    – HorusKol
    13 hours ago










  • @HorusKol Good point, added. I think I misread the question and thought it referenced existing solar panels, but it seems it doesn't.
    – Napoleon Wilson
    13 hours ago












  • I hope this answer doesn't come across as too patronizingly anti-oil, though. There still has to be a place where "real men" drive "real cars" and the Mad Max films definitely are that place. ;-)
    – Napoleon Wilson
    12 hours ago












  • No replacement for displacement!
    – SiXandSeven8ths
    10 hours ago






  • 1




    Even more than possibly lacking the solar collection technology, they may lack the battery technology. It's battery technology that limits the use of solar for vehicles even more than solar collection technology. You can't power cars directly from sunlight (there's simply not enough of it, even if you had 100% efficient panels,) so high-density batteries are required. Currently, per mass, Li metal batteries store about 1/25 of the energy of gasoline. For Li-ion batteries, it ranges from about 1/130 to 1/50. They would need battery tech at least this good, preferably better.
    – reirab
    7 hours ago















up vote
18
down vote













There are various aspect to this. But lets first start with some possible in-universe explanations:




  • First of all gasoline (or "guzzoline") is heavily ingrained in the culture of the War Boys. While it is more the raw power of cars they are about (with things like the valhalla spray, character names like "Organic Mechanic" for the doctor and imagery like Max being used as a living radiator mascot), this "horse power machismo" just doesn't work as well without fossil fuel.


  • They might not even have the technology or know-how to harness solar energy anymore, as their technology seems largely old and scavanged (okay, bionic arms nothwithstanding ;-)). But even then their cars are also largely reassembled scrapyard cars and it might very well be that they just didn't have the ability or willingness to completely redesign their engines for solar ectricity.


  • While they seem to be quite inventive, there might also not be much of a motivation for that either, since fuel does actually seem to exist in sufficient amount. Now it's true the smaller tribes (who in turn might lack solar technology) are fighting for every last drop of fuel, but it's also apparent that Joe's War Boys seem to have a good economy going with the guys over at Gas Town and there could very well be a resistance to overthrow that established economy and the other poltical advatages it brings (not all too dissimilar to the economic resistance the abandoning of fossil fuels is facing in our present time).



And this also leads to a larger aspect of all this. There generally seems to be a resistance to abandon the old ways, the ways that ultimately led to the downfall of the world as it is in Fury Road (or earlier films too). This whole "who killed the world" mantra and the archaic War Boy culture of Immortan Joe seems to be somewhat of a statement against the warlord machismo that supposedly made people destroy the world with their fights over fossil fuels. Granted, this is all only hinted in the film (elaborated a little in this related question and its answers), but the fight over fuel is a major aspect of many of the Mad Max films and it doesn't take much to take that as a parable of the state of our world and the way it's headed. It's no accident that Wolfgang M. Schmitt Jr. even compares the imagery of the world as presented in Fury Road to Werner Herzog's Lessons of Darkness (about the Kuwaitian oil fires) in his analysis of the film (unfortunately not available in English).



This, last but not not least, brings us directly to the massive role that gasoline and its associated themes plays for the entire Mad Max mythos. Those films are about motion, cars and raw horse power as much as (or even more than) they are about Max himself. From the very first film that has the police battle gangs in muscle cars, over the 2nd one centred aound a small enclave of humans trying to protect their only gas truck as a symbol of hope for the future. Though, the 3rd did actually reference a shift towards a replacement for gas (still, not electric rather than just bio-generated carbon fuel). The 2nd and 3rd film also end with a massive multi-car chase, a concept that Fury Road not only continued but basically extended to the entire movie.



Now you could say you could as well do car chases with Tesla Roadsters, but tell that to a man who grew up in the 80s (and Max Rockatansky is pretty much a product of the 80s, even if not diegetically) as driver of "The Last of the V8s"! These films are about raw fossil fuel force. In fact Fury Road drives this obsession to new heights with the above mentioned aspects of War Boy culture. Those films and the worlds they are depicting are obsessed with gasoline despite and because this obsession led to those worlds.






share|improve this answer























  • Not to mention that there's 100 years of intense scientific and technological development between the internal combustion engine and solar power generation. It's quite probable that society is no longer capable of manufacturing and maintaining solar panels.
    – HorusKol
    13 hours ago










  • @HorusKol Good point, added. I think I misread the question and thought it referenced existing solar panels, but it seems it doesn't.
    – Napoleon Wilson
    13 hours ago












  • I hope this answer doesn't come across as too patronizingly anti-oil, though. There still has to be a place where "real men" drive "real cars" and the Mad Max films definitely are that place. ;-)
    – Napoleon Wilson
    12 hours ago












  • No replacement for displacement!
    – SiXandSeven8ths
    10 hours ago






  • 1




    Even more than possibly lacking the solar collection technology, they may lack the battery technology. It's battery technology that limits the use of solar for vehicles even more than solar collection technology. You can't power cars directly from sunlight (there's simply not enough of it, even if you had 100% efficient panels,) so high-density batteries are required. Currently, per mass, Li metal batteries store about 1/25 of the energy of gasoline. For Li-ion batteries, it ranges from about 1/130 to 1/50. They would need battery tech at least this good, preferably better.
    – reirab
    7 hours ago













up vote
18
down vote










up vote
18
down vote









There are various aspect to this. But lets first start with some possible in-universe explanations:




  • First of all gasoline (or "guzzoline") is heavily ingrained in the culture of the War Boys. While it is more the raw power of cars they are about (with things like the valhalla spray, character names like "Organic Mechanic" for the doctor and imagery like Max being used as a living radiator mascot), this "horse power machismo" just doesn't work as well without fossil fuel.


  • They might not even have the technology or know-how to harness solar energy anymore, as their technology seems largely old and scavanged (okay, bionic arms nothwithstanding ;-)). But even then their cars are also largely reassembled scrapyard cars and it might very well be that they just didn't have the ability or willingness to completely redesign their engines for solar ectricity.


  • While they seem to be quite inventive, there might also not be much of a motivation for that either, since fuel does actually seem to exist in sufficient amount. Now it's true the smaller tribes (who in turn might lack solar technology) are fighting for every last drop of fuel, but it's also apparent that Joe's War Boys seem to have a good economy going with the guys over at Gas Town and there could very well be a resistance to overthrow that established economy and the other poltical advatages it brings (not all too dissimilar to the economic resistance the abandoning of fossil fuels is facing in our present time).



And this also leads to a larger aspect of all this. There generally seems to be a resistance to abandon the old ways, the ways that ultimately led to the downfall of the world as it is in Fury Road (or earlier films too). This whole "who killed the world" mantra and the archaic War Boy culture of Immortan Joe seems to be somewhat of a statement against the warlord machismo that supposedly made people destroy the world with their fights over fossil fuels. Granted, this is all only hinted in the film (elaborated a little in this related question and its answers), but the fight over fuel is a major aspect of many of the Mad Max films and it doesn't take much to take that as a parable of the state of our world and the way it's headed. It's no accident that Wolfgang M. Schmitt Jr. even compares the imagery of the world as presented in Fury Road to Werner Herzog's Lessons of Darkness (about the Kuwaitian oil fires) in his analysis of the film (unfortunately not available in English).



This, last but not not least, brings us directly to the massive role that gasoline and its associated themes plays for the entire Mad Max mythos. Those films are about motion, cars and raw horse power as much as (or even more than) they are about Max himself. From the very first film that has the police battle gangs in muscle cars, over the 2nd one centred aound a small enclave of humans trying to protect their only gas truck as a symbol of hope for the future. Though, the 3rd did actually reference a shift towards a replacement for gas (still, not electric rather than just bio-generated carbon fuel). The 2nd and 3rd film also end with a massive multi-car chase, a concept that Fury Road not only continued but basically extended to the entire movie.



Now you could say you could as well do car chases with Tesla Roadsters, but tell that to a man who grew up in the 80s (and Max Rockatansky is pretty much a product of the 80s, even if not diegetically) as driver of "The Last of the V8s"! These films are about raw fossil fuel force. In fact Fury Road drives this obsession to new heights with the above mentioned aspects of War Boy culture. Those films and the worlds they are depicting are obsessed with gasoline despite and because this obsession led to those worlds.






share|improve this answer














There are various aspect to this. But lets first start with some possible in-universe explanations:




  • First of all gasoline (or "guzzoline") is heavily ingrained in the culture of the War Boys. While it is more the raw power of cars they are about (with things like the valhalla spray, character names like "Organic Mechanic" for the doctor and imagery like Max being used as a living radiator mascot), this "horse power machismo" just doesn't work as well without fossil fuel.


  • They might not even have the technology or know-how to harness solar energy anymore, as their technology seems largely old and scavanged (okay, bionic arms nothwithstanding ;-)). But even then their cars are also largely reassembled scrapyard cars and it might very well be that they just didn't have the ability or willingness to completely redesign their engines for solar ectricity.


  • While they seem to be quite inventive, there might also not be much of a motivation for that either, since fuel does actually seem to exist in sufficient amount. Now it's true the smaller tribes (who in turn might lack solar technology) are fighting for every last drop of fuel, but it's also apparent that Joe's War Boys seem to have a good economy going with the guys over at Gas Town and there could very well be a resistance to overthrow that established economy and the other poltical advatages it brings (not all too dissimilar to the economic resistance the abandoning of fossil fuels is facing in our present time).



And this also leads to a larger aspect of all this. There generally seems to be a resistance to abandon the old ways, the ways that ultimately led to the downfall of the world as it is in Fury Road (or earlier films too). This whole "who killed the world" mantra and the archaic War Boy culture of Immortan Joe seems to be somewhat of a statement against the warlord machismo that supposedly made people destroy the world with their fights over fossil fuels. Granted, this is all only hinted in the film (elaborated a little in this related question and its answers), but the fight over fuel is a major aspect of many of the Mad Max films and it doesn't take much to take that as a parable of the state of our world and the way it's headed. It's no accident that Wolfgang M. Schmitt Jr. even compares the imagery of the world as presented in Fury Road to Werner Herzog's Lessons of Darkness (about the Kuwaitian oil fires) in his analysis of the film (unfortunately not available in English).



This, last but not not least, brings us directly to the massive role that gasoline and its associated themes plays for the entire Mad Max mythos. Those films are about motion, cars and raw horse power as much as (or even more than) they are about Max himself. From the very first film that has the police battle gangs in muscle cars, over the 2nd one centred aound a small enclave of humans trying to protect their only gas truck as a symbol of hope for the future. Though, the 3rd did actually reference a shift towards a replacement for gas (still, not electric rather than just bio-generated carbon fuel). The 2nd and 3rd film also end with a massive multi-car chase, a concept that Fury Road not only continued but basically extended to the entire movie.



Now you could say you could as well do car chases with Tesla Roadsters, but tell that to a man who grew up in the 80s (and Max Rockatansky is pretty much a product of the 80s, even if not diegetically) as driver of "The Last of the V8s"! These films are about raw fossil fuel force. In fact Fury Road drives this obsession to new heights with the above mentioned aspects of War Boy culture. Those films and the worlds they are depicting are obsessed with gasoline despite and because this obsession led to those worlds.







share|improve this answer














share|improve this answer



share|improve this answer








edited 13 hours ago

























answered 13 hours ago









Napoleon Wilson

41.1k34257499




41.1k34257499












  • Not to mention that there's 100 years of intense scientific and technological development between the internal combustion engine and solar power generation. It's quite probable that society is no longer capable of manufacturing and maintaining solar panels.
    – HorusKol
    13 hours ago










  • @HorusKol Good point, added. I think I misread the question and thought it referenced existing solar panels, but it seems it doesn't.
    – Napoleon Wilson
    13 hours ago












  • I hope this answer doesn't come across as too patronizingly anti-oil, though. There still has to be a place where "real men" drive "real cars" and the Mad Max films definitely are that place. ;-)
    – Napoleon Wilson
    12 hours ago












  • No replacement for displacement!
    – SiXandSeven8ths
    10 hours ago






  • 1




    Even more than possibly lacking the solar collection technology, they may lack the battery technology. It's battery technology that limits the use of solar for vehicles even more than solar collection technology. You can't power cars directly from sunlight (there's simply not enough of it, even if you had 100% efficient panels,) so high-density batteries are required. Currently, per mass, Li metal batteries store about 1/25 of the energy of gasoline. For Li-ion batteries, it ranges from about 1/130 to 1/50. They would need battery tech at least this good, preferably better.
    – reirab
    7 hours ago


















  • Not to mention that there's 100 years of intense scientific and technological development between the internal combustion engine and solar power generation. It's quite probable that society is no longer capable of manufacturing and maintaining solar panels.
    – HorusKol
    13 hours ago










  • @HorusKol Good point, added. I think I misread the question and thought it referenced existing solar panels, but it seems it doesn't.
    – Napoleon Wilson
    13 hours ago












  • I hope this answer doesn't come across as too patronizingly anti-oil, though. There still has to be a place where "real men" drive "real cars" and the Mad Max films definitely are that place. ;-)
    – Napoleon Wilson
    12 hours ago












  • No replacement for displacement!
    – SiXandSeven8ths
    10 hours ago






  • 1




    Even more than possibly lacking the solar collection technology, they may lack the battery technology. It's battery technology that limits the use of solar for vehicles even more than solar collection technology. You can't power cars directly from sunlight (there's simply not enough of it, even if you had 100% efficient panels,) so high-density batteries are required. Currently, per mass, Li metal batteries store about 1/25 of the energy of gasoline. For Li-ion batteries, it ranges from about 1/130 to 1/50. They would need battery tech at least this good, preferably better.
    – reirab
    7 hours ago
















Not to mention that there's 100 years of intense scientific and technological development between the internal combustion engine and solar power generation. It's quite probable that society is no longer capable of manufacturing and maintaining solar panels.
– HorusKol
13 hours ago




Not to mention that there's 100 years of intense scientific and technological development between the internal combustion engine and solar power generation. It's quite probable that society is no longer capable of manufacturing and maintaining solar panels.
– HorusKol
13 hours ago












@HorusKol Good point, added. I think I misread the question and thought it referenced existing solar panels, but it seems it doesn't.
– Napoleon Wilson
13 hours ago






@HorusKol Good point, added. I think I misread the question and thought it referenced existing solar panels, but it seems it doesn't.
– Napoleon Wilson
13 hours ago














I hope this answer doesn't come across as too patronizingly anti-oil, though. There still has to be a place where "real men" drive "real cars" and the Mad Max films definitely are that place. ;-)
– Napoleon Wilson
12 hours ago






I hope this answer doesn't come across as too patronizingly anti-oil, though. There still has to be a place where "real men" drive "real cars" and the Mad Max films definitely are that place. ;-)
– Napoleon Wilson
12 hours ago














No replacement for displacement!
– SiXandSeven8ths
10 hours ago




No replacement for displacement!
– SiXandSeven8ths
10 hours ago




1




1




Even more than possibly lacking the solar collection technology, they may lack the battery technology. It's battery technology that limits the use of solar for vehicles even more than solar collection technology. You can't power cars directly from sunlight (there's simply not enough of it, even if you had 100% efficient panels,) so high-density batteries are required. Currently, per mass, Li metal batteries store about 1/25 of the energy of gasoline. For Li-ion batteries, it ranges from about 1/130 to 1/50. They would need battery tech at least this good, preferably better.
– reirab
7 hours ago




Even more than possibly lacking the solar collection technology, they may lack the battery technology. It's battery technology that limits the use of solar for vehicles even more than solar collection technology. You can't power cars directly from sunlight (there's simply not enough of it, even if you had 100% efficient panels,) so high-density batteries are required. Currently, per mass, Li metal batteries store about 1/25 of the energy of gasoline. For Li-ion batteries, it ranges from about 1/130 to 1/50. They would need battery tech at least this good, preferably better.
– reirab
7 hours ago










up vote
9
down vote













Same reason we don't do more green energy today:



Batteries.



We tend to think of solar panels as things you might put on your roof to generate power for direct use but the real "off the grid" application of solar (and wind) has it going into a bank of batteries. The solar charges the batteries; the batteries run your stuff. The bigger your solar array and the more batteries you can hook up, the better.



Lead-acid batteries are pretty simple and should be within the ability of Mad Max people to create and maintain but they are heavy and their energy density is far lower than lithium batteries. Lithium batteries are complex and probably outside the technology level of Mad Max colonies (if you're familiar with the Tesla Wall, that's lithium-ion based -- high tech stuff). You can certainly run electric vehicles off of lead-acid batteries (golf carts, for instance) but the weight to power ratio of lead-acid makes them not well suited to long ranges, heavy loads or lots of fast acceleration.



Additional topics of research if you Want To Know More: battery types & electric cars; battery manufacturing; why we still use diesel for our 18-wheelers.



In short, it's easy to imagine a clean, green, electric powered colony in the Mad Max world. It's also easy to imagine them getting smashed by the War Boys because when it comes to low tech energy production, it's hard to beat gasoline. For moving heavy things or smashing an up-armored bus into your neighbor's gate after a 100 mile drive, gasoline is the way to go.



(Just as a related footnote, batteries are quieter than nuclear reactors which is why electric submarines are great. Why not switch to all electric subs? We probably would, if we could get batteries with higher energy density. Nuclear submarines can stay down much longer than electric subs, which eventually need to surface to run their diesal engines and recharge their batteries.)






share|improve this answer








New contributor




JamieB is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.


















  • Nice answer. In order to get a feel for what kind of differences we're talking about here, browsing the Wikipedia page for Energy Density is helpful. In particular, lead-acid batteries have a specific energy of about 0.17 MJ/kg. Li-ion batteries range from 0.36 to 0.875. Li metal (e.g. Li-Po) is around 1.8. Gasoline is around 46 and diesel 48. Jet fuel/kerosene is around 43. So, gasoline stores 50-100 times as much energy per unit mass as Li-ion batteries and almost 300 times as much as lead-acid batteries.
    – reirab
    4 hours ago








  • 1




    Also of importance (especially in airplanes, but also in road vehicles): fuel weight burns off as the fuel is used. Battery weight remains constant as its energy is depleted. So, fossil fuels effectively get another 2x multiplier on specific energy vs. batteries on top of their already huge current advantages.
    – reirab
    4 hours ago

















up vote
9
down vote













Same reason we don't do more green energy today:



Batteries.



We tend to think of solar panels as things you might put on your roof to generate power for direct use but the real "off the grid" application of solar (and wind) has it going into a bank of batteries. The solar charges the batteries; the batteries run your stuff. The bigger your solar array and the more batteries you can hook up, the better.



Lead-acid batteries are pretty simple and should be within the ability of Mad Max people to create and maintain but they are heavy and their energy density is far lower than lithium batteries. Lithium batteries are complex and probably outside the technology level of Mad Max colonies (if you're familiar with the Tesla Wall, that's lithium-ion based -- high tech stuff). You can certainly run electric vehicles off of lead-acid batteries (golf carts, for instance) but the weight to power ratio of lead-acid makes them not well suited to long ranges, heavy loads or lots of fast acceleration.



Additional topics of research if you Want To Know More: battery types & electric cars; battery manufacturing; why we still use diesel for our 18-wheelers.



In short, it's easy to imagine a clean, green, electric powered colony in the Mad Max world. It's also easy to imagine them getting smashed by the War Boys because when it comes to low tech energy production, it's hard to beat gasoline. For moving heavy things or smashing an up-armored bus into your neighbor's gate after a 100 mile drive, gasoline is the way to go.



(Just as a related footnote, batteries are quieter than nuclear reactors which is why electric submarines are great. Why not switch to all electric subs? We probably would, if we could get batteries with higher energy density. Nuclear submarines can stay down much longer than electric subs, which eventually need to surface to run their diesal engines and recharge their batteries.)






share|improve this answer








New contributor




JamieB is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.


















  • Nice answer. In order to get a feel for what kind of differences we're talking about here, browsing the Wikipedia page for Energy Density is helpful. In particular, lead-acid batteries have a specific energy of about 0.17 MJ/kg. Li-ion batteries range from 0.36 to 0.875. Li metal (e.g. Li-Po) is around 1.8. Gasoline is around 46 and diesel 48. Jet fuel/kerosene is around 43. So, gasoline stores 50-100 times as much energy per unit mass as Li-ion batteries and almost 300 times as much as lead-acid batteries.
    – reirab
    4 hours ago








  • 1




    Also of importance (especially in airplanes, but also in road vehicles): fuel weight burns off as the fuel is used. Battery weight remains constant as its energy is depleted. So, fossil fuels effectively get another 2x multiplier on specific energy vs. batteries on top of their already huge current advantages.
    – reirab
    4 hours ago















up vote
9
down vote










up vote
9
down vote









Same reason we don't do more green energy today:



Batteries.



We tend to think of solar panels as things you might put on your roof to generate power for direct use but the real "off the grid" application of solar (and wind) has it going into a bank of batteries. The solar charges the batteries; the batteries run your stuff. The bigger your solar array and the more batteries you can hook up, the better.



Lead-acid batteries are pretty simple and should be within the ability of Mad Max people to create and maintain but they are heavy and their energy density is far lower than lithium batteries. Lithium batteries are complex and probably outside the technology level of Mad Max colonies (if you're familiar with the Tesla Wall, that's lithium-ion based -- high tech stuff). You can certainly run electric vehicles off of lead-acid batteries (golf carts, for instance) but the weight to power ratio of lead-acid makes them not well suited to long ranges, heavy loads or lots of fast acceleration.



Additional topics of research if you Want To Know More: battery types & electric cars; battery manufacturing; why we still use diesel for our 18-wheelers.



In short, it's easy to imagine a clean, green, electric powered colony in the Mad Max world. It's also easy to imagine them getting smashed by the War Boys because when it comes to low tech energy production, it's hard to beat gasoline. For moving heavy things or smashing an up-armored bus into your neighbor's gate after a 100 mile drive, gasoline is the way to go.



(Just as a related footnote, batteries are quieter than nuclear reactors which is why electric submarines are great. Why not switch to all electric subs? We probably would, if we could get batteries with higher energy density. Nuclear submarines can stay down much longer than electric subs, which eventually need to surface to run their diesal engines and recharge their batteries.)






share|improve this answer








New contributor




JamieB is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.









Same reason we don't do more green energy today:



Batteries.



We tend to think of solar panels as things you might put on your roof to generate power for direct use but the real "off the grid" application of solar (and wind) has it going into a bank of batteries. The solar charges the batteries; the batteries run your stuff. The bigger your solar array and the more batteries you can hook up, the better.



Lead-acid batteries are pretty simple and should be within the ability of Mad Max people to create and maintain but they are heavy and their energy density is far lower than lithium batteries. Lithium batteries are complex and probably outside the technology level of Mad Max colonies (if you're familiar with the Tesla Wall, that's lithium-ion based -- high tech stuff). You can certainly run electric vehicles off of lead-acid batteries (golf carts, for instance) but the weight to power ratio of lead-acid makes them not well suited to long ranges, heavy loads or lots of fast acceleration.



Additional topics of research if you Want To Know More: battery types & electric cars; battery manufacturing; why we still use diesel for our 18-wheelers.



In short, it's easy to imagine a clean, green, electric powered colony in the Mad Max world. It's also easy to imagine them getting smashed by the War Boys because when it comes to low tech energy production, it's hard to beat gasoline. For moving heavy things or smashing an up-armored bus into your neighbor's gate after a 100 mile drive, gasoline is the way to go.



(Just as a related footnote, batteries are quieter than nuclear reactors which is why electric submarines are great. Why not switch to all electric subs? We probably would, if we could get batteries with higher energy density. Nuclear submarines can stay down much longer than electric subs, which eventually need to surface to run their diesal engines and recharge their batteries.)







share|improve this answer








New contributor




JamieB is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.









share|improve this answer



share|improve this answer






New contributor




JamieB is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.









answered 7 hours ago









JamieB

1911




1911




New contributor




JamieB is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.





New contributor





JamieB is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.






JamieB is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.












  • Nice answer. In order to get a feel for what kind of differences we're talking about here, browsing the Wikipedia page for Energy Density is helpful. In particular, lead-acid batteries have a specific energy of about 0.17 MJ/kg. Li-ion batteries range from 0.36 to 0.875. Li metal (e.g. Li-Po) is around 1.8. Gasoline is around 46 and diesel 48. Jet fuel/kerosene is around 43. So, gasoline stores 50-100 times as much energy per unit mass as Li-ion batteries and almost 300 times as much as lead-acid batteries.
    – reirab
    4 hours ago








  • 1




    Also of importance (especially in airplanes, but also in road vehicles): fuel weight burns off as the fuel is used. Battery weight remains constant as its energy is depleted. So, fossil fuels effectively get another 2x multiplier on specific energy vs. batteries on top of their already huge current advantages.
    – reirab
    4 hours ago




















  • Nice answer. In order to get a feel for what kind of differences we're talking about here, browsing the Wikipedia page for Energy Density is helpful. In particular, lead-acid batteries have a specific energy of about 0.17 MJ/kg. Li-ion batteries range from 0.36 to 0.875. Li metal (e.g. Li-Po) is around 1.8. Gasoline is around 46 and diesel 48. Jet fuel/kerosene is around 43. So, gasoline stores 50-100 times as much energy per unit mass as Li-ion batteries and almost 300 times as much as lead-acid batteries.
    – reirab
    4 hours ago








  • 1




    Also of importance (especially in airplanes, but also in road vehicles): fuel weight burns off as the fuel is used. Battery weight remains constant as its energy is depleted. So, fossil fuels effectively get another 2x multiplier on specific energy vs. batteries on top of their already huge current advantages.
    – reirab
    4 hours ago


















Nice answer. In order to get a feel for what kind of differences we're talking about here, browsing the Wikipedia page for Energy Density is helpful. In particular, lead-acid batteries have a specific energy of about 0.17 MJ/kg. Li-ion batteries range from 0.36 to 0.875. Li metal (e.g. Li-Po) is around 1.8. Gasoline is around 46 and diesel 48. Jet fuel/kerosene is around 43. So, gasoline stores 50-100 times as much energy per unit mass as Li-ion batteries and almost 300 times as much as lead-acid batteries.
– reirab
4 hours ago






Nice answer. In order to get a feel for what kind of differences we're talking about here, browsing the Wikipedia page for Energy Density is helpful. In particular, lead-acid batteries have a specific energy of about 0.17 MJ/kg. Li-ion batteries range from 0.36 to 0.875. Li metal (e.g. Li-Po) is around 1.8. Gasoline is around 46 and diesel 48. Jet fuel/kerosene is around 43. So, gasoline stores 50-100 times as much energy per unit mass as Li-ion batteries and almost 300 times as much as lead-acid batteries.
– reirab
4 hours ago






1




1




Also of importance (especially in airplanes, but also in road vehicles): fuel weight burns off as the fuel is used. Battery weight remains constant as its energy is depleted. So, fossil fuels effectively get another 2x multiplier on specific energy vs. batteries on top of their already huge current advantages.
– reirab
4 hours ago






Also of importance (especially in airplanes, but also in road vehicles): fuel weight burns off as the fuel is used. Battery weight remains constant as its energy is depleted. So, fossil fuels effectively get another 2x multiplier on specific energy vs. batteries on top of their already huge current advantages.
– reirab
4 hours ago





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